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  #1  
Old 02 August 2010, 09:44 PM
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Default Amended plaques at Auschwitz

Comment: THESE ARE THE TWO PLAQUES THAT WERE INSTALLED ON
THE FRONT GATE TO THE DEATH CAMP (AUSCHWITZ), THE TOP ONE
WAS INSTALLED JUST AFTER IT CLOSED AFTER WWII , IT SAYS THAT
4 MILLION JEWS WERE KILLED BETWEEN 1940-1945!!! THIS PLAQUE HAS
SINCE BEEN REMOVED!!!

THE LOWER PHOTO IS THE CURRENT PLAQUE THAT IS ATTACHED TO THE
ENTRANCE TO THE DEATH CAMP (AUSCHWITZ)! IT SAYS THAT 1.5 MILLION
JEWS WERE KILLED BETWEEN 1940 -1945 !!!

WHAT HAPPENED TO THE OTHER 2 1/2 MILLION DEAD JEWS ????
IT IS NOT LIKE THEY COULD HAVE MISPLACED 2 1/2 MILLION PEOPLE !!

THINK ABOUT IT !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! WHERE DID THEY GO ?????

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  #2  
Old 02 August 2010, 10:52 PM
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Maybe the 2.5 million only suffered.
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  #3  
Old 02 August 2010, 11:07 PM
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According to the article in Wikipedia, the 4 000 000 number was a Communist calculation, and it was only after the fall of the Iron Curtain that the current estimate was able to be made.
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  #4  
Old 03 August 2010, 12:21 AM
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You'd think that if about 6 million Jews died in the entire Holocaust, it's pretty unlikely that two thirds of them would have died at one camp, even if it was the largest.

The OP also seems to not recognize that the plaque commemorates those that died at that particular site, as opposed to being representative of the entire Holocaust.

- Il-Mari
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  #5  
Old 03 August 2010, 08:41 AM
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According to the BBC History Magazine book The Second World War Story recent research has established that about 1.1 million Jews were killed at Auschwitz. The first large scale killing of Jews did not start until Spring 1942. Aushwitz was built in 1940, but before 1942 it was mainly used to kill Polish political prisoners, sick and disabled people as well as Soviet POWs. (see pages 58 - 64).
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  #6  
Old 03 August 2010, 08:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Il-Mari View Post
You'd think that if about 6 million Jews died in the entire Holocaust, it's pretty unlikely that two thirds of them would have died at one camp, even if it was the largest.

The OP also seems to not recognize that the plaque commemorates those that died at that particular site, as opposed to being representative of the entire Holocaust.

- Il-Mari
There were only six extermination camps - Auschwitz-Birkenau, Belzec, Majdanek, Treblinka and Kulmhof (or Chelmno). Many Jews were killed at other concentration camps, but the six extermination camps was were they were killed routinely.
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  #7  
Old 03 August 2010, 08:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew of Ware View Post
There were only six extermination camps - Auschwitz-Birkenau, Belzec, Majdanek, Treblinka and Kulmhof (or Chelmno). Many Jews were killed at other concentration camps, but the six extermination camps was were they were killed routinely.
I thought Sobibor was an extermination camp as well. Granted it closed in 1943, but I thought it was considered an extermination camp.
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  #8  
Old 03 August 2010, 09:55 AM
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Apologies kitap. You're quite right Sobibor was the sixth camp. I mentioned six in my post and then only listed five. See the map on page 61 in the BBC book I mentioned. By the way, after Auschwitz's 1.1 million Jews killed the next worse camp was Treblinka with 0.9 million Jews kiled.
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  #9  
Old 03 August 2010, 11:58 AM
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Well, there were the gypsies, ethnic poles and other minorities that were also killed there... not just jewish people
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  #10  
Old 03 August 2010, 02:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spookshow Baby View Post
Well, there were the gypsies, ethnic poles and other minorities that were also killed there... not just jewish people
Also gays, the disabled, Jehovah's Witnesses, and other political and religious dissenters. That's why both plaques say *people* were killed. Most were Jews; but millions more were not.

ETA: St. Edith Stein, Blessed Jozef Jankowski, St. Maximilian Kolbe, Blessed Boleslaw Strzelecki, Fr. Bruno Zembol, Br. Stanisław Trojanowski, Fr. Jozef Kowalski, Fr. Kazimierz Sykulski, Fr. Ludwik Pius Bartosik, Fr. Piotr Edward Dankowski, Fr. Roman Sitko, Fr. Wojciech Nierychlewski, Sr. Katarzyna Faron, Br. Piotr Bonifacy Żukowski, Br. Symforian Ducki, Bishop Nowowiejski of Plock and Sr. Maria Klemensa Staszewska were all killed at Auschwitz, just to name a few.

From The Gentile Holocaust:
Quote:
If we must rank the Nazis' victims, it is only right to place the Jews first. They were the primary target of the Nazis. For as long as the Third Reich endured, they bore the full brunt of Nazi hatred. And when the Third Reich collapsed, six million Jews were dead, over one million of them children. The slaughter inflicted on the Slavs, the Gypsies and the other designated victims of the Third Reich was haphazard compared to the systematic annihilation of the Jews.... It diminishes the Jewish Holocaust not at all, however, to remember the millions of others who were also victims of the Nazis. On the contrary, it reminds us of the staggering power of evil in the world.
Four Kitties

Last edited by Four Kitties; 03 August 2010 at 02:32 PM.
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  #11  
Old 03 August 2010, 02:34 PM
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Of the 6 million Poles killed in WW2, half were Jewish. That means half were not - 3 million people - including the military, political and academic elite, gays, disabled persons, Gypsies, Sinti, priests and other members of the clergy (both Catholic and Orthodox), and just your run-of-the-mill average joe who happened to be in the wrong place at the wrong time. For the most part, the Nazi's did not discriminate.

From the accounts of my relatives, the Nazi's use of force and terror, to pacify the conquered territories, was feared for many reasons. All it took was a simple - even anonymous - accusation, and people and whole families were wiped out. There was no penalty for making a false accusation, because the Nazi's could not afford any such thing. Anyone labelled as being opposed to occupation, was summarily dispatched in one of many ways. Some of my mother's family suffered this fate.

Both sets of grandparents survived the war in occupied eastern Poland, having been "liberated" by the russians in early 1945. My grandfather (on my father's side) was 19 and a carpenter by trade, so he was kept around and put to work by the Nazi occupiers, building barracks. By late 1940 or early 1941, the power grid was back and he was working in the local sugar mill. He survived by keeping a low profile on all sides - the partisans would come by asking for, then demanding food and other supplies, and beating you up if you didn't have any. That's when he got his own gun. Some partisans were just thugs who armed themselves and took advantage of the peasants who had little themselves, with little regard for actually fighting the war. As the war progressed, his land was taken away and given to ethnic Germans from Czech lands, and he even survived one situation where he was "caught" in the forest and was being taken away when rescued by partisans - the "good" ones.
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  #12  
Old 03 August 2010, 03:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew of Ware View Post
There were only six extermination camps - Auschwitz-Birkenau, Belzec, Majdanek, Treblinka and Kulmhof (or Chelmno). Many Jews were killed at other concentration camps, but the six extermination camps was were they were killed routinely.
On the other hand the death camps were only one aspect (albeit a gruesome one) of the Holocaust. The einsatzgruppen in Eastern Europe and Russia killed a large portion of that 6 million as well.
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  #13  
Old 03 August 2010, 04:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew of Ware View Post
There were only six extermination camps - Auschwitz-Birkenau, Belzec, Majdanek, Treblinka and Kulmhof (or Chelmno). Many Jews were killed at other concentration camps, but the six extermination camps was were they were killed routinely.
I don't really know why you emphasize 'only.' Even if there were six, wouldn't it be unlikely that two thirds of the total would be killed in one place?

And why aren't you counting Jasenovac and Maly Trastsianiets? Combined, those extermination camps account for maybe 100,000 Jews and 600,000 other 'undesirables.'

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jasenov...entration_camp
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maly_Tr...rmination_camp

- Il-Mari
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  #14  
Old 03 August 2010, 04:18 PM
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Check out the masonary behind the plagues. These may be at the same camp but they're not on the same wall.
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