Citizens' 170 km/h car chase aids in arrest

[Canuckistan]

Two Ottawa men's decision to chase a car through residential roads at speeds exceeding 170 km/h to catch a suspected rapist has sparked a debate as to how far citizens should go when trying to help police.

http://thestar.ca/news/canada/article/699171

[jimmy101_again]

170 KPH = 105 MPH, "through residential roads". The men should be thrown in jail for a couple years.

They are damn lucky they didn't kill a bunch of people.

[Canuckistan]

Originally Posted by jimmy101_again

170 KPH = 105 MPH, "through residential roads". The men should be thrown in jail for a couple years.

Except, as the article notes, they were under the direction of 911 at the time, so they were under police supervision.

They are damn lucky they didn't kill a bunch of people.

I can agree to this.

[jimmy101_again]

Originally Posted by Canuckistan

Except, as the article notes, they were under the direction of 911 at the time, so they were under police supervision.

That's what the police are claiming. I don't think chatting with a 911 operator while driving at 100+MPH qualifies as "police supervision".

Be interesting to ask the Police if they would have paid the lawsuits that would have resulted if there had been a big-ass crash that killed a couple of bystanders. If the two were operating under "police supervision" then the police force must accept all responsibility and liability for what happens.

"Our operator did not do what he should have done .... Thank God nothing happened," he said.

"'When they put her in the back of the car, that was heroism,' White said. 'What happened after wasn't'."

So if they had actually been police officers they would not have pursued the car since they would have had the victim in their own car.

Don't see much legal justification and "police supervision" is a cop-out to avoid prosecuting the two idiots.

[Canuckistan]

Originally Posted by jimmy101_again

That's what the police are claiming.

Since the police are the ones who ultimately lay the charges, isn't their say rather important?

I don't think chatting with a 911 operator while driving at 100+MPH qualifies as "police supervision".

The police disagree with you.

Be interesting to ask the Police if they would have paid the lawsuits that would have resulted if there had been a big-ass crash that killed a couple of bystanders. If the two were operating under "police supervision" then the police force must accept all responsibility and liability for what happens.

Yes, that's about it.

Don't see much legal justification and "police supervision" is a cop-out to avoid prosecuting the two idiots.

Or, it could be that the police are admitting their part in this incident.

[DAnnino]

This is just plain insane. Going 105 MPH chasing the suspect while on the phone with 911? Get the plate, then get the victim to a hospital. Don't chase the guy. My guess is, neither O'Connor nor Spezza were armed. What if the bad guy was? It could have been a lot worse.

Another example of the Hollywood mentality.

[MidgardDragon]

They broke the law, doesn't matter who or what they were "trying to catch" (and it could well be that they were breaking a law just be pursuing him). Yay for encouraging vigilantiism, I guess? It's been discussed to death how this "they should die" attitude some people have towards criminals and their seeming willingness to do it counts as vigilantiism, but it's always dismissed as the person saying it just having "an emotional reaction". Now that we're seeing it in action we're going to still approve of it, though, huh? Guess some people better be retracting their "well if that person really meant what they said" comments.

[AnglRdr]

Originally Posted by DAnnino

This is just plain insane. Going 105 MPH chasing the suspect while on the phone with 911? Get the plate, then get the victim to a hospital. Don't chase the guy. My guess is, neither O'Connor nor Spezza were armed. What if the bad guy was? It could have been a lot worse.

I wonder what their training in operating a motor vehicle at that speed was.

[Canuckistan]

Originally Posted by AnglRdr

I wonder what their training in operating a motor vehicle at that speed was.

I have a friend who races professionally. I doubt even he would have taken part in this.

[jimmy101_again]

Originally Posted by Canuckistan

Since the police are the ones who ultimately lay the charges, isn't their say rather important?

Are they? I'm not familar with the laws in Ottawa, but in the states it is the district attorney or grand jury that does the charging, not the police.

What the police think is basically irrelevant, the only thing that matters is what the DA thinks for charging, and what the courts think for a conviction.

[Canuckistan]

Originally Posted by jimmy101_again

Are they? I'm not familar with the laws in Ottawa, but in the states it is the district attorney or grand jury that does the charging, not the police.

What the police think is basically irrelevant, the only thing that matters is what the DA thinks for charging, and what the courts think for a conviction.

But don't the police have to bring an actual case to the prosecutor? IOW, if they don't, the Crown won't do much.

[daisyslegs]

OK, very BASIC question.... did at anytime these fellows say to the dispatcher HOW FAST they were going to keep up?

personally, I applaud them. High speeds in residential? dangerous as hell. Some residential can be quite straight and deserted. thank God no one else was injured, but at least find out if dispatch knew how fast they were going! I just cant see them saying "holy cow, we hit 170 KM!" and the dispatcher not saying slow down.

But I keep mentally coming back to "please catch that SOB before he hurts someone else!"

Sexual predators have a tendency to repeat. Want statistics? Ask Ryda. Ask Brooke Wilburger.

Ask so many. If they can still speak. When are we gonna figure this out?

[jimmy101_again]

Originally Posted by Canuckistan

But don't the police have to bring an actual case to the prosecutor? IOW, if they don't, the Crown won't do much.

In the US, no they do not. Bernie Maidoff wasn't charged because of a police investigation. The investigation was carried out by people from the DA office and federal regulators.

In the US most DA offices have their own investigators and for some types of crimes the police simply carry out the arrest warrant at the direction of the DA.
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At 170 KMH (~100 MPH) that's about 150 feet per second. Typical human response time and vehicle stopping distance from that speed means the car will probably travel at least 300 feet (100m) before it can come to a stop, and perhaps as much as 1,000 feet (305m) if the road surface is poor or wet, or if the driver doesn't respond correctly. So if anything happens in front of the car within a distance of more than the length of a football field the driver will not be able to respond fast enough to avoid it.

At 300 feet, from within a bouncing car, at night, a pedestrian isn't even visible at that distance.

[Eddylizard]

I have to come down on the side of stupid and dangerous. Jimmy101_again's figures give even more substance to that. They took the victim into their car (good) then subjected her to a terrifying ride (not good).

Under those circumstances, and without the victim in the back, it is highly likely that a police pursuit vehicle will abandon the pursuit. Chasing a driver encourages him to keep increasing his speed to try to get away; now you have two vehicles with two drivers travelling at maniac speeds, either of whom could make a mistake with tragic consequences.

They should have gotten as much detail of the perpetrators car as they could, and taken her straight to a trauma unit/police station her choice. With enough detail, the police will find him.