Ice knife murder

[snopes]

Comment: I heard that a person was murdered by being stabbed by a knife
made of ice. However, the criminal got away because the evidence had
melted.

[Silas Sparkhammer]

It's a classic of murder mysteries, but, really, it's very little different from any other murder where the weapon is disposed of. What, in real terms, is the difference between this, and stabbing someone with an ordinary knife, which is then ditched at sea, dropped into a well, or buried in the desert?

If the blade is left in the wound to melt, would the accumulation of water be noticed in an autopsy? If so, this technique would leave *more* evidence than would be left by an ordinary knife!

Silas

[snopes]

Originally Posted by Silas Sparkhammer

What, in real terms, is the difference between this, and stabbing someone with an ordinary knife, which is then ditched at sea, dropped into a well, or buried in the desert?

Unlike the latter, there's no chance that the former will ever be found.

[Troberg]

Originally Posted by snopes

Unlike the latter, there's no chance that the former will ever be found.

Well, that's true, but, on the other hand, there is a very distinct possibility that the tools used to create the ice implement would be found.

Besides, ice is too brittle to make a reliable weapon.

[Stoneage Dinosaur]

How would anyone ever know the murder weapon was an ice knife rather than an ordinary blade? Unless the OP is implying that the suspect got away with the crime because there was no murder weapon to be used as evidence, but even then there must be witnesses who had seen the murder take place for it to be known an ice knife was used.

[kitap]

Originally Posted by Silas Sparkhammer

It's a classic of murder mysteries, but, really, it's very little different from any other murder where the weapon is disposed of. What, in real terms, is the difference between this, and stabbing someone with an ordinary knife, which is then ditched at sea, dropped into a well, or buried in the desert?

If the blade is left in the wound to melt, would the accumulation of water be noticed in an autopsy? If so, this technique would leave *more* evidence than would be left by an ordinary knife!

Silas

I remember-correctly, I hope- a mystery story in one of Ellery Queen's anthologies- The FirstHhundred Years of Crime Fiction, I think, where the ice knife was used in a Turkish steam bath so no one noticed the excess water.

[Singing in the Drizzle]

I keep thinking of just how unpractical it would be to make a working ice knife (lance or spear would be a better name) then get it to the victim and use it. I would think bludgeoning someone to death a block of ice would be much easier.

[snopes]

Originally Posted by Troberg

Well, that's true, but, on the other hand, there is a very distinct possibility that the tools used to create the ice implement would be found.

Tools which would likely have a plausible variety of other uses and would therefore be of little or no value as evidence.

[Bill Door]

Originally Posted by kitap

I remember-correctly, I hope- a mystery story in one of Ellery Queen's anthologies- The FirstHhundred Years of Crime Fiction, I think, where the ice knife was used in a Turkish steam bath so no one noticed the excess water.

...And a tea leaf in the wound gave the game away...

- Bill Door

[Gayle]

A frozen leg of lamb is a much better weapon.

[Bill Door]

Originally Posted by Gayle

A frozen leg of lamb is a much better weapon.

Especially if the investigating officers are hungry.

- Bill Door

[damian]

Originally Posted by Gayle

A frozen leg of lamb is a much better weapon.

Originally Posted by Bill Door

Especially if the investigating officers are hungry.

- Bill Door

"Tales Of The Unexpected: Lambs To The Slaughter".

[Gayle]

Ronald Dahl short story first

[Lainie]

A similar idea was used, to great karmic satisfaction, in The Lovely Bones.

[Brad from Georgia]

The ice dagger (as well as bullets made of frozen blood) is mentioned in John Dickson Carr's The Hollow Man (1935), in which Carr's amateur detective Dr. Gideon Fell delivers a long lecture on "impossible" murders.

[Joostik]

Originally Posted by Silas Sparkhammer

If the blade is left in the wound to melt, would the accumulation of water be noticed in an autopsy? If so, this technique would leave *more* evidence than would be left by an ordinary knife!

What kind of evidence would that be? You can't take fingerprints from a melted ice knife, nor can you determine its origin or link it in any other way to a suspect.

ETA:

Originally Posted by Bill Door

...And a tea leaf in the wound gave the game away...

Okay, you've convinced me.

[Silas Sparkhammer]

Originally Posted by Joostik

What kind of evidence would that be? You can't take fingerprints from a melted ice knife, nor can you determine its origin or link it in any other way to a suspect. . . .

Just the presence of water where it shouldn't be. That, in itself, might be suspicious. (I don't know enough anatomy to say whether it would be detected by the medical examiner.)

Of course, the big gaping knife-wound, with no knife to be found, would also be mildly suspicious...

Silas

[RCIAG]

Didn't Mythbusters do both the ice knife & ice bullets & debunked that either one would work?

[Joostik]

Originally Posted by Silas Sparkhammer

Of course, the big gaping knife-wound, with no knife to be found, would also be mildly suspicious...

That's precisely what I meant: That the victim has been murdered would be quite obvious, whatever knife was used. Now how can this particular weapon be used to determine the murderer?

[WildaBeast]

Originally Posted by RCIAG

Didn't Mythbusters do both the ice knife & ice bullets & debunked that either one would work?

They definately did ice bullet. I don't recall them doing ice knife, though.