Religious lady keeps miscarriage?

[Diabolus Ex Deus]

I just don't see how this would be legal in most places:

http://www.documentingreality.com/fo...ge-keeps-9496/

I'm skeptical myself, though I wouldn't entirely put it past some super religious folks.

[Nana M]

It looks like she is saying goodbye, to me. That's common with a stillbirth, in fact, hospitals encourage it here. This may be stretching the definition, but I don't find it overly 'weird'.

[Spamamander]

These kinds of things make me very uncomfortable. I can't tell others how to grieve, or when it becomes a "stillbirth" as opposed to a "miscarriage", and maybe it is healthier for some people to grieve like this... but a part of me doesn't really see it. My mom said she lost a pregnancy at 5 months and they simply whisked the fetus away, it had deformities on the back of its head (I don't think she even found out the gender) that would have been incompatible with life. She was able to treat it as a lost pregnancy rather than the death of a baby, and move on.

The opposite end of the spectrum was a friend of mine who lost twins, I'm not sure how far along she was. What horrified me was receiving a card in the mail with real size images of their footprints, one perhaps an inch and a half at most, the other much smaller. These were treated as stillbirths and given a burial at the local cemetery complete with names and headstone. Again... I can't decide what is healthy for others but this just seemed to be more hurtful than it would help. Plus the card really did make me queasy.

[Halfmad]

Ai-yi-yi!!!!! That last photo totally freaked me out! I've seen photos of families saying goodbye before, but never with a fetus that looked like that! That's just...is it just me, or are those other kids going to have nightmares?!

[rhiandmoi]

I have a feeling that the baby was born alive and was alive for a couple of hours, in which case it would not be a miscarriage or sitll birth, but more along the lines of an extreme micro-preemie. I doubt the mother kept the body after the family was done saying goodbye.

When I lost my first pregnancy at six months gestation it was treated as a stillbirth, no different from one that would have occurred at full term. Legally any pregnancy that ends after 20 weeks here has to get a birth certificate and have a funeral; thats one thing. But the hospital basically MADE us do the footprints/handprints/photos thing. "THIS IS HOW YOU WILL GRIEVE AND YOU'RE GONNA LIKE IT" was very much the message I got from the social workers and nurses there.

Looking back I can see that it was like a massive over-reaction from them in response to the old days of pretending like stillbirths and miscarriages just didn't happen; however I think there is (or should be) a middle ground of letting people cope how they want. If it happened to me now at six months gestation I would be very, very against them forcing me to have photos and do the whole 'rememberence' thing (ie the foot and handprints, whole proper ceremonial funeral etc). I actually think it made me cope worse than if I'd been kinda made to just get over it. As it is I got over it very well on my own by recognising that all the fuss wasn't necessary, but many other women I met in the months after my experience were in the depths of despair and I don't actually think thats healthy at all.


ETA: As for "keeping a miscarriage" "this can't be legal" blah blah blah, like I was trying to say in my ramble up there, the nurses and doctors give the dead fetus to you to hold for how ever long you want - a couple of hours maybe, and we were allowed to come back how ever much we wanted until it was funeral time a few days later post-autopsy.

Originally Posted by Spamamander

The opposite end of the spectrum was a friend of mine who lost twins, I'm not sure how far along she was. What horrified me was receiving a card in the mail with real size images of their footprints, one perhaps an inch and a half at most, the other much smaller. These were treated as stillbirths and given a burial at the local cemetery complete with names and headstone. Again... I can't decide what is healthy for others but this just seemed to be more hurtful than it would help. Plus the card really did make me queasy.

Spamamander, thats just standard procedure in Australia. Proper funerals, (and burial or cremation) are mandatory for all babies born after 20 weeks.

[callee]

what part of that was religious?

[Complex Kid]

A couple of years ago, a co-worker of mine had a miscarriage and emailed us pictures of the fetus. It looked very much like the one in the OP. In one pic, the fetus was "holding" a tiny teddy bear that was about as big as it was. I was totally not expecting how, um, upsetting the pics would be and was really shocked when I saw them. She had a funeral and everything for the fetus, which struck me as odd since she wasn't that far along. But I think this kind of mourning is normal, to a certain extent, and it certainly helped her grieve.

[Lainie]

Originally Posted by Spamamander

The opposite end of the spectrum was a friend of mine who lost twins, I'm not sure how far along she was. What horrified me was receiving a card in the mail with real size images of their footprints, one perhaps an inch and a half at most, the other much smaller. These were treated as stillbirths and given a burial at the local cemetery complete with names and headstone.

Originally Posted by kia

Spamamander, thats just standard procedure in Australia. Proper funerals, (and burial or cremation) are mandatory for all babies born after 20 weeks.

There are similar laws in the US. My mother lost two pregnancies, one at 3 months and one at 6. The baby she lost at six months had to be buried. Funerals aren't mandatory, though.

[Banrion]

My mother worked in a Lutheran hospital many years ago, and she talks about how they would respect the parents' wishes, and would baptize these babies on request and allow the parents to grieve however they felt necessary.

[Lainie]

Originally Posted by callee

what part of that was religious?

I don't know, and I doubt that the OP knows, either. I think the thread was named in accordance with ULMB rules.

[franjava]

As others have said, it looks like the family is saying goodbye. Nurses are trained to put together stuff for these families (locks of hair, pictures, footprints are taken, etc.) The family was given their grieving time. My only real WTF is that it looks like they took it home. I didn't think that was even allowed. But, you know, whatever.

ETA: Darned those uber-religoiusy folks!

[DemonWolf]

From first hand experience, I see nothing unusual about this.

When a still birth occurs, the family is allowed to hold the baby and say their goodbyes. Sometimes pictures are taken. The hospital give the family a "memory box" containing footprints, handprints, a lock of hair, and a few other items that I cannot recall right now. It is all part of remembering the deceaced and mourning. Some day, you may want to take out the box and remember your lost little one.

You are also offered counciling and given many pamphlets with stupid names like "still to be born." They try to pressure you into counciling.

I feel very sad for this family. Looking at the pics made me tear up. The insensitive peron who posted this private moment and those who ridiculed this family are truly sick.

[DemonWolf]

Originally Posted by franjava

As others have said, it looks like the family is saying goodbye. Nurses are trained to put together stuff for these families (locks of hair, pictures, footprints are taken, etc.) The family was given their grieving time. My only real WTF is that it looks like they took it home. I didn't think that was even allowed. But, you know, whatever.

ETA: Darned those uber-religoiusy folks!

I don't think that they took it home. I think that the baby was swaddled and a cap put on while they held him/her. That's what they did for me.

I remember holding Joseph and being surprised at how worm he was and I remember unwrapping him just a little to peek at his tiny fingers and toes and being a little happy that he was so perfect - except for the whole dead thing.

[Lainie]

Originally Posted by DemonWolf

I remember holding Joseph and being surprised at how worm he was and I remember unwrapping him just a little to peek at his tiny fingers and toes and being a little happy that he was so perfect - except for the whole dead thing.

I'm so sorry. Hugs.

[Mad Jay]

Differrent people grieve in differrent ways. Although, the pictures do make me uncomfortable, I am much more appaled by the person who thinks it is appropriate to spread photos of a family's private moment all over the internet

[TrishDaDish]

Originally Posted by DemonWolf

I don't think that they took it home. I think that the baby was swaddled and a cap put on while they held him/her. That's what they did for me.

I get the impression they're home too, as the first two pictures and last three pictures are taken in a hospital bed, while the rest are taken with the mother fully dressed on a normal bed with home-like curtains on the wall.

[DemonWolf]

Originally Posted by TrishDaDish

I get the impression they're home too, as the first two pictures and last three pictures are taken in a hospital bed, while the rest are taken with the mother fully dressed on a normal bed with home-like curtains on the wall.

Many L&D wards have rooms that look "homey" to allow the family to bond with the new addition in a less hospital-like enviroment. It is supposed to e more relaxing. My wife's bed had a wooden headboard and curtains as well.

However, after looking again, that does not look like a wooden hospital bed headboard and the pictures on the wall as well as a lack of "fixtures" do seem to suggest a home. However, I doubt that the hospital would allow them to take it home. With us, The hospital offered to dispose of the body or to allow us to have a funeral home pick up the body for burial.

I was also told that autopsy was SOP to find out the cause of the stillbirth to prevent future problems.

[chocolate kisses]

Originally Posted by Mad Jay

Differrent people grieve in differrent ways. Although, the pictures do make me uncomfortable, I am much more appaled by the person who thinks it is appropriate to spread photos of a family's private moment all over the internet

I totally agree with you. I am also appalled at the hateful posts following the pictures. I am surprised they were allowed to take the body home, if that's where they are, but could it be acceptable and legal in some other corner of the world?

[BatmanBeatles]

I think it's a little weird to have the children hold the baby.