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  #101  
Old 22 March 2014, 05:55 PM
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Originally Posted by Cervus View Post
Maybe she wants to pay her own way through life and be financially independent instead of relying on her parents. It really doesn't matter why.
It certainly doesn't matter to me. I have an idea it may matter to her parents. But that's not really my point. What bothered me right from the start was the "gee college costs so much a girl has to do porn just to get by" :shrug: not a big deal in the grand scheme of things but it bugged me for some reason.
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  #102  
Old 22 March 2014, 05:56 PM
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Which is just part and parcel of our culture of slut shaming, assuming they care.
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  #103  
Old 22 March 2014, 06:00 PM
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Just to be clear, parents would prefer that their daughter have to do porn she doesn't enjoy to pay for school, or they would prefer she be enjoying doing the porn that is helping her through school?
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  #104  
Old 22 March 2014, 06:06 PM
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Also, 1) the cost of college in America is legitimately ridiculous, and 2) the amount of slutshaming she has received because of her choice to do porn is also legitimately ridiculous.

It doesn't matter why she's doing porn. She does not deserve the level of vitriol that has been and continues to be directed at her. Our culture wants our sex workers to be victims so we can feel bad for them and try to save them from what we see as their poor choices. She refuses to fit into that mold and so people are angry.
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  #105  
Old 22 March 2014, 06:14 PM
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Yeah, what Aimee said. The only socially acceptable sex worker is the struggling, exploited woman who's only doing what she must to survive until she's rescued from her life of sin by some heroic man. If she *gasp* enjoys her job she's a dirty shameful slut who doesn't belong in the company of good, wholesome people.
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  #106  
Old 22 March 2014, 06:19 PM
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Originally Posted by RichardM View Post
I don't think most of us, male or female, would go to a strip club with their mother.
Single data point, and quite possibly not relevant to the type of club being discussed:

In the late 1970's, when I was in my late twenties and my mother and uncle were in their 60's, my uncle was showing my mother and me around Paris.

One of the places to which he took us was a nightclub. The dancing was truly excellent, so was the music, the show was funny. Nobody, including my in some ways rather prudish mother, seemed to think anything odd about it. But there was definitely stripping involved; at some points most of the performers (who were both male and female) were down to G-strings, no pasties.

So maybe it depends on the strip club. Or, I suppose, on the mother.
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  #107  
Old 22 March 2014, 06:51 PM
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Also people (I think at least) tend to feel very apprehensive about the idea of women who are empowered by taking control of their sexuality instead of letting males be the one who control it as history has allowed it (or rather in some cases dictated it). It also directly opposes the idea that sex is supposed to be a procreating act (like the Bible tells us!) and not an activity that you derive pleasure out of.

I think the latter explains why people tend to be vitriolic against porn actors and actresses since their actions are so out there against norms on sexuality. As Crocoduck and Aimee point out, we like to make these women as victims or sluts and I think it’s because it’s the only way we (g) don’t have to endorse their activities.


ETA:

Quote:
Originally Posted by RichardM View Post
I don't think most of us, male or female, would go to a strip club with their mother. Or maybe some would. .
Single data point. Several years ago, my Mom and myself went to Vegas for a long weekend (my brother and dad could not go for various reasons) and one of the things that we did is we went to see Cirq de Solie’s Zumanity show. While it wasn’t a strip club it was the closest thing to it you can get and there was a lot of nudity (which we did expect some of, just not was there). It was targeted toward couples. I remember leaving the show and collectively saying, lets go to the bar or something else since it was rather uncomfortable for us.

Last edited by diddy; 22 March 2014 at 06:56 PM.
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  #108  
Old 22 March 2014, 09:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RichardM View Post
The question is can you be good and not be a gentleman?

One definition of a gentleman is not doing anything in public you wouldn't do if accompanied by your mother. I don't think most of us, male or female, would go to a strip club with their mother. Or maybe some would.

PS: You can certainly be a gentleman in public and still be a terrible person, i.e. run a polluting industry, be a miser, etc.
Gottcha, I thought you were implying that a man who frequented such places was a scummy or shady person or some such thing.
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  #109  
Old 22 March 2014, 11:32 PM
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I think most parents would prefer their kids didn't perform porn for a living. Porn is not the sort of career parents hope for their kids. Now it is true that once your child is an adult all bets are off if they are on their own and supporting themselves. Whether it's good or bad that this is the way porn is viewed is moot because for now it is the reality. The one big issue I have with this reality is the oft mentioned double standards.

Personally, I think of sex as a private thing between consenting adults, but that's my opinion and I'm not the arbiter of what is right. Apparently though, Ms. Weeks loved and respected her parents feelings enough to not share her vocation with them until she had no choice. I hope that they as a family can stand together against the disgusting onslaught of hate being hurled at Ms. Weeks. It sounds like they raised a very smart and independent daughter, so I assume if they are shocked or disappointed they'll get over it and see that she is strong, still their child, and walking her own path even if it diverges from what they had hoped for her.
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  #110  
Old 22 March 2014, 11:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GenYus234 View Post
Can anyone recall an even where a male college athlete was found to be working as a stripper or in porn? If so, what was the result?

I'm curious to see which double standard is stronger, "men-stud, women-whore" or "patronizing sex work good, providing sex work bad". If male athlete(s) are also kicked off the team, then it might be more about providing sex work being the issue than the gender standard (not that the latter wouldn't exist or make things worse).

Of course, the lack of such stories might be because the male athletes aren't punished as severely or at all, thereby making for a nothing story. Or because female students (or homosexually inclined male students) that make such a discovery don't say anything for fear of the backlash they'd receive.
I realize you asked this over a month ago, but in case you're still wondering, I did recall one story of a college wrestler in 2008 who got kicked off the team for doing some pretty tame porn (jacking off solo) videos. http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/otl/n...ory?id=4242983
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  #111  
Old 23 March 2014, 03:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thorny locust View Post
Single data point, and quite possibly not relevant to the type of club being discussed:

In the late 1970's, when I was in my late twenties and my mother and uncle were in their 60's, my uncle was showing my mother and me around Paris.

One of the places to which he took us was a nightclub. The dancing was truly excellent, so was the music, the show was funny. Nobody, including my in some ways rather prudish mother, seemed to think anything odd about it. But there was definitely stripping involved; at some points most of the performers (who were both male and female) were down to G-strings, no pasties.

So maybe it depends on the strip club. Or, I suppose, on the mother.
More on the club I think. When I think of strip club, I don't think of night clubs. I think more of lap dances which as a rule, are not part of a caberet performance or Cirque de Soleil either.
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  #112  
Old 24 March 2014, 05:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aimee Evilpixie View Post
It doesn't matter why she's doing porn.
It does, at least to me, when the woman involved announces her reason for being in that line of work was due to necessity if she was to attend university, then it later comes out that her parents are well off.

Duke porn starlet says hardcore career necessary to defray $58,000 Duke price tag

Notice that she didn't announce she was doing porn to empower women or because she enjoyed it or because she saw nothing morally amiss about it. The announced reason was to be able to afford the school she was attending. And that was crock.

This gal got caught out by a classmate, and when so cornered came up with this story about having to do porn as her only way of attending school. In other words, she embraced slut-shaming behaviour, in that rather than give a real reason (or none at all) she pleaded the standard excuse for any woman's making her living on her back, which was economic necessity.
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  #113  
Old 24 March 2014, 07:12 AM
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Was it said somewhere that her parents had actually been paying for her schooling the whole time? Because just because she comes from a well off family doesn't mean that she's getting the money from her parents.

I come from a fairly well-off family, and I've paid my own way through college.
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  #114  
Old 24 March 2014, 07:54 AM
Barbara
 
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It's been said (in this thread, even) that her parents paid for her to attend private schools. It's therefore not much of a stretch to assume they've also been underwriting her costs at Duke. It was also stated (in one of the stories about this woman) that she was receiving financial aid to attend Duke.

The "financial necessity" kite doesn't fly, as far as I'm concerned. Also, from this story, we learn:

Quote:
but during the course of our month-long correspondence she does not hesitate to show off to me her recently-purchased iPad mini and array of designer handbags.
Forget about the mini-iPad; let's talk about designer handbags. I know what those puppies go for, and I know very few women who own even one, let alone an "array" of them. (For those that don't know, your basic Prada is going to run you somewhere between $1,200 and $2,400, and in terms of the designer handbag world, those are considered the entry point. There are far, far more expensive handbags out there. And yes, Prada does occasionally put out something in a canvas or raffia tote, but even those have a starting price of about $800.)

For those in the mood to do a little window shopping, here's a link to the Prada handbags at Bluefly.

Folks who are financially strapped don't own a designer handbag, let alone an array of them.
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  #115  
Old 24 March 2014, 02:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Barbara View Post
... she pleaded the standard excuse for any woman's making her living on her back, which was economic necessity.
Quibble: I am far from being an expert, but my impression is that on average the female performers do not spend all that much time on their backs.
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  #116  
Old 24 March 2014, 04:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Barbara View Post
It's been said (in this thread, even) that her parents paid for her to attend private schools. It's therefore not much of a stretch to assume they've also been underwriting her costs at Duke. It was also stated (in one of the stories about this woman) that she was receiving financial aid to attend Duke.

The "financial necessity" kite doesn't fly, as far as I'm concerned.
Because she's got a job that pays her a ton of money instead of working some other job that would have longer hours, less flexible scheduling, and pays a whole lot less so that she can only afford to pay for tuition and nothing else?

Because it's looking to me a lot like you're both accusing her of embracing slut-shaming and trying to shame the slut at the same time.
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  #117  
Old 24 March 2014, 05:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Barbara View Post
The announced reason was to be able to afford the school she was attending. And that was crock.
I wonder, though, could it be she just felt obligated to make up a "good" reason because she knew she'd be slut-shamed otherwise (and probably even if she really did need it to pay for Duke, but perhaps less so)? Which means the problem -slut shaming - remains the same, even if she was lying.

The impressive purse collection sounds to me like a mark of someone who has suddenly come into a lot of money for the first time in her life and hasn't had a lot of practice handling it.
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  #118  
Old 24 March 2014, 05:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crocoduck_hunter View Post
Because it's looking to me a lot like you're both accusing her of embracing slut-shaming and trying to shame the slut at the same time.
As I understand it, Barbara is criticizing the lies, not the porn vocation.
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  #119  
Old 24 March 2014, 05:17 PM
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And maybe she likes designer bags (personally I can't imagine why, but I'm not her) and earns enough money to buy them. It's none of my business how she chooses to spend her legally earned money as long as she's legally spending it. She's the victim here, and she didn't do anything wrong. Except trust the wrong person.
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  #120  
Old 24 March 2014, 05:18 PM
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Just because her parents have paid for school in the past doesn't mean they would have necessarily agreed to pay this much, for this school. They could have said they'll pay for cheaper school X, but not Duke. Or they could have cut her off for reasons we don't know, or as Cervus said, she may have been determined to pay her own way and found a way to do it.

It is true that her explanation was one that people tend to find more acceptable from sex workers though, so it's possible she picked it for that reason. But as Dave says, that's part of slut shaming, not any sort of proof against it.
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