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  #21  
Old 20 March 2014, 01:05 AM
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Originally Posted by thorny locust View Post
Richard W and overyonder, do you think it is a "fetish" to be attracted to the body type of a significant proportion of the population?
Yes, basically - if you have a strong enough attraction to a particular body type that you'd arrange an orgy specifically to include only people of that body type, I'd say that was a fetish. It's not me who invented the term "Big Beautiful Women".

Personally I'm attracted to women of various shapes and sizes, but if I had to state a preference for a body type it would probably be quite petite women. If I arranged an orgy with exclusively petite women then I'd say that was a fetish... not that I would, obviously, for lots of reasons - not least that my preference isn't strong enough to count as a fetish.

If this was just a random orgy some of whose participants happened to be overweight, then I'd say they were misusing the term "Big Beautiful Women" rather than the term "overweight". The story implies that the guy who rented the flat did so specifically so that he could have an orgy with lots of large women. That may not be what actually happened, but it's what the story is saying.

And the idea of orgies is inherently amusing anyway (to those of us who don't go to them)... so yes, I do think that adding a fetish makes them more amusing.
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  #22  
Old 20 March 2014, 12:12 PM
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It's not at all clear from the article, but I more or less assumed that the original renter (who, after all, is a comedian) used the "overweight orgy" language in relating the story, and that the paper just ran with it. Poor journalism, but the alliteration makes for a funnier standup line than "BBW party" or similar.
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  #23  
Old 20 March 2014, 02:40 PM
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Actually, the article says the original renter, the comedian, found his renter's name involved with an advertiesemnt online. This may be why he qualified the fracas as he did.

Quote:
When Teman later searched Carter’s phone number on the Internet, he found the raunchy soiree involving plus-size women advertised online as “Turn Up Part 2: The Pantie Raid.”

One person even blasted out Teman’s Seventh Avenue address in a tweet for an “XXX FREAK FEST.”

Carter denied he had anything to do with the ad.
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  #24  
Old 20 March 2014, 02:55 PM
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Originally Posted by Johnny Slick View Post
...and if it had been S&M, that also would have been unneccessary.
Why is it unncessary if it's factual? The bit about BBW wasn't an opinion, but factual.

OY
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  #25  
Old 20 March 2014, 03:12 PM
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The haircolor, eyecolor and DOBs of the particpants are equally factual. So are the names of their kindergarten teachers. Just because something's factual doesn't mean it's necessary to a news article.
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  #26  
Old 20 March 2014, 03:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Lainie View Post
The haircolor, eyecolor and DOBs of the particpants are equally factual. So are the names of their kindergarten teachers. Just because something's factual doesn't mean it's necessary to a news article.
Eye color and DOB aren't a qualifier to "orgy". if you were describing the people themselves, sure.

Had it been a food orgy, it (food) would be relevant too.

OY
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  #27  
Old 20 March 2014, 03:28 PM
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I still don't see the relevance. Were the cops called because the orgy participants were fat? Was that why the other residents objected?

ETA: Maybe the leaseholder wouldn't have objected to the orgy if it involved non-plus-size people. That would change the point of the story to me, from "Air B-N-B guy oversteps his boudns" to "leaseholder is an ass and I wouldn't want to be his neighbor."
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  #28  
Old 20 March 2014, 03:41 PM
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The whole article is unnecessary in that sense, though - it's not like it's actually newsworthy or in the public interest; they've reported it because it's funny.
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  #29  
Old 20 March 2014, 03:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard W View Post
The whole article is unnecessary in that sense, though - it's not like it's actually newsworthy or in the public interest; they've reported it because it's funny.
I didn't find it funny at all. I see it from the point of view of the landlord, and I'd be rather PO'ed if any kind of orgy (yes even food orgy!) happened in a place I owned without my knowledge. I find the premise of any type of orgy to NOT be funny.

OY

Last edited by overyonder; 20 March 2014 at 04:13 PM.
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  #30  
Old 20 March 2014, 04:03 PM
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It's more novelty than humor, except for the OMG THEY WERE FAT CHICKS!!!! part.
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  #31  
Old 20 March 2014, 06:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard W View Post
Yes, basically - if you have a strong enough attraction to a particular body type that you'd arrange an orgy specifically to include only people of that body type, I'd say that was a fetish. .
Several definitions of "fetish" from the first page of Google results:

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/fetish

Quote:
fet·ish also fet·ich (fĕt′ĭsh, fē′tĭsh)
n.
1. An object that is believed to have magical or spiritual powers, especially such an object associated with animistic or shamanistic religious practices.
2. An object of unreasonably excessive attention or reverence: made a fetish of punctuality.
3. Something, such as a material object or a nonsexual part of the body, that arouses sexual desire and may become necessary for sexual gratification.
4. An abnormally obsessive preoccupation or attachment; a fixation.
Quote:
http://www.oxforddictionaries.com/us...english/fetish

An inanimate object worshiped for its supposed magical powers or because it is considered to be inhabited by a spirit.

1.1A course of action to which one has an excessive and irrational commitment: he had a fetish for writing more opinions each year than any other justice

1.2A form of sexual desire in which gratification is linked to an abnormal degree to a particular object, item of clothing, part of the body, etc.: Victorian men developed fetishes focusing on feet, shoes, and boots
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=fetish

Quote:
1. An object thought to have magical, especially magically sexual, powers

2. A sexual fixation or obsession with a usually non-sexual object. EX. socks, horses, monkeys, pain, bondage
http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/fetish

Quote:
1a : an object (as a small stone carving of an animal) believed to have magical power to protect or aid its owner; broadly : a material object regarded with superstitious or extravagant trust or reverence
b : an object of irrational reverence or obsessive devotion : prepossession
c : an object or bodily part whose real or fantasied presence is psychologically necessary for sexual gratification and that is an object of fixation to the extent that it may interfere with complete sexual expression
2: a rite or cult of fetish worshipers
3: fixation
None of the results, either quoted above or otherwise found on that search, described an attraction to entire live humans, of whatever shape, as a "fetish". And it is IMO insulting to real live humans of whatever shape to state that being sexually attracted to them is a fetish.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard W View Post
The whole article is unnecessary in that sense, though - it's not like it's actually newsworthy or in the public interest; they've reported it because it's funny.
I have no idea of the motivations of the originators of the story. However, it doesn't need to be "funny" to be news. Damage to the apartment is newsworthy. The kind of party that causes the police to be called is newsworthy. In fact, pretty much anything that causes the police to be called out is newsworthy. In addition, it's entirely newsworthy that using a common apartment exchange service may result in trouble for one of the participants -- it's not that nobody should use such services, but that they should be aware of the potential downsides of allowing strangers to use one's house or apartment while one is away.

And if the implication is that it makes the article funnier to have fat people involved: that's insulting. Anybody who is fat, as well as many people who are not, is well aware that there are people who think that fat people are funny because of being fat. That doesn't mean that it's necessary to accept the insult as just part of the nature of humans.
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  #32  
Old 20 March 2014, 06:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thorny locust View Post
None of the results, either quoted above or otherwise found on that search, described an attraction to entire live humans, of whatever shape, as a "fetish". And it is IMO insulting to real live humans of whatever shape to state that being sexually attracted to them is a fetish.
Yes they do - 3 and 4 in the first one, for example.

Do you seriously think that anybody who's sexually attracted to an overweight person is attracted to them specifically because they're overweight, rather than for any other qualities? I'm not saying that if you fancy a fat person you're a fetishist.
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  #33  
Old 20 March 2014, 06:54 PM
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If they are attracted to them to such an extent that they feel the need to specify a term that generally refers to larger, potentially overweight women? Yes.
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  #34  
Old 20 March 2014, 06:56 PM
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Exactly, GenYus, that's what I meant. Thanks.

(eta) They're NOT attracted to "the entire, live human" - they're attracted to the fat.
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  #35  
Old 20 March 2014, 07:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard W View Post
Exactly, GenYus, that's what I meant. Thanks.

(eta) They're NOT attracted to "the entire, live human" - they're attracted to the fat.
Of course the same could be said for any other type of fetish, be it for breasts, hair color, etc etc etc.

OY
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  #36  
Old 20 March 2014, 08:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard W View Post
Yes they do - 3 and 4 in the first one, for example.
Quote:
3. Something, such as a material object or a nonsexual part of the body, that arouses sexual desire and may become necessary for sexual gratification.
4. An abnormally obsessive preoccupation or attachment; a fixation.
Nope.

They hired people, presumably expecting their sexual parts to be included, as well as the rest of them.

And we have no idea whether they had "an abnormally obsessive preoccupation or attachment" or whether they found a particular size of partner "necessary for sexual gratification". We know that, on one particular occasion, they hired people of a larger than average size range. We have no idea who they have sex with the rest of the time.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard W View Post
Do you seriously think that anybody who's sexually attracted to an overweight person is attracted to them specifically because they're overweight, rather than for any other qualities? I'm not saying that if you fancy a fat person you're a fetishist.
No, of course I'm not. I'm saying that being sexually attracted to people currently defined as "overweight" is well within the range of normal human sexual behavior; and not something to be laughed at or described as a "fetish".

And I'm saying that you sound exactly as if you're saying that anyone who fancies a fat person is a fetishist.


Quote:
Originally Posted by GenYus234 View Post
If they are attracted to them to such an extent that they feel the need to specify a term that generally refers to larger, potentially overweight women? Yes.
See my response above.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard W View Post
They're NOT attracted to "the entire, live human" - they're attracted to the fat.
If a lump of fat had been delivered instead of entire, live sex workers, do you seriously think they'd have been satisfied?



If they had requested blondes on the specific occasion, would either of you have assumed that they were obsessed with blonde hair, and entirely uninterested in and incapable of sexual relations with brunettes? If they had requested people between the ages of twenty and thirty-five, would you have thought "they must have a fetish"?

For that matter, would you have thought it was funny, worthy of being in the headline, and definable as a fetish, if they had requested people within what is currently defined as a "normal" weight range?
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  #37  
Old 20 March 2014, 09:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thorny locust View Post
And I'm saying that you sound exactly as if you're saying that anyone who fancies a fat person is a fetishist.
The issue is not that they fancy a BBW. The issue is that they do not fancy someone who is not a BBW to such an extent that they feel the need to exclude non-BBW from the orgy.

Quote:
If they had requested blondes on the specific occasion, would either of you have assumed that they were obsessed with blonde hair, and entirely uninterested in and incapable of sexual relations with brunettes? If they had requested people between the ages of twenty and thirty-five, would you have thought "they must have a fetish"?
From my understanding of the invite, it was not a request that the women be BBW, but they only BBW were invited. If so, then that would mean the invitation in your hypothetical would be for blondes or 20-35s only, other hair colors or ages are not invited. If a certain secondary or tertiary characteristic is so important to their sexuality that they do not wish to have sex with someone without that characteristic, then that is fetishistic behavior.
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  #38  
Old 20 March 2014, 09:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GenYus234 View Post
If a certain secondary or tertiary characteristic is so important to their sexuality that they do not wish to have sex with someone without that characteristic, then that is fetishistic behavior.
Again, we have no idea what they do the rest of the time. All we know is what they wanted to do on that one occasion. Maybe they all usually have slim or average weight partners, and wanted some variety.

If they had requested someone to perform oral sex, would you say that must be a fetish, and they must be incapable of other sex acts? If they had requested someone for PIV, would you say that meant they must have a fetish, and must be incapable of doing anything else?

And, while we're at it: if they had requested people all of "normal" weight, or people all between twenty and thirty-five, would you have expected that to be in the headline? would you expect people to find that this made the story more "amusing"?
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  #39  
Old 20 March 2014, 09:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thorny locust View Post
Again, we have no idea what they do the rest of the time. All we know is what they wanted to do on that one occasion. Maybe they all usually have slim or average weight partners, and wanted some variety.
No we don't. Which is why I didn't claim that they only had a fetish for BBW. But, on this occasion, they were fetishistic for BBW.
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  #40  
Old 20 March 2014, 09:28 PM
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Originally Posted by GenYus234 View Post
No we don't. Which is why I didn't claim that they only had a fetish for BBW. But, on this occasion, they were fetishistic for BBW.
By that definition, every sex act anyone ever has, alone or with anyone at all, is fetishistic.
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