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  #121  
Old 24 March 2014, 04:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by A Turtle Named Mack View Post
As I understand it, Barbara is criticizing the lies, not the porn vocation.
I'm not sure I would characterize a headline or even what someone is alleged to have said in an interview as a lie just because it doesn't match up with another piece of information. The more personal contact I have with the media, the less surprised I should be by the massive gap between what was actually said and what was reported as said, and yet it still continues to surprise me. For example, I was once quoted as in a newspaper as saying that there were more faculty at my old university in domestic partnerships than were married. What I had actually said was that there were more faculty in domestic partnerships than people probably think. Another example, I went to a talk by Christopher Hitchens about Mother Terera in which he was reported as complaining that "it [poverty] hadn't been swept out." He actually said that "it [the hospital room] hadn't been swept out." Not really the same thing.
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  #122  
Old 24 March 2014, 05:34 PM
St. Alia St. Alia is offline
 
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Originally Posted by Barbara View Post
It does, at least to me, when the woman involved announces her reason for being in that line of work was due to necessity if she was to attend university, then it later comes out that her parents are well off.

Duke porn starlet says hardcore career necessary to defray $58,000 Duke price tag
The OP doesn't say that in the article though. It says:
Quote:
Lauren got into the adult film industry as a way to defray the exorbitant cost of attendance at Duke, where the grand total for tuition, fees and room and board is about $58,000 per year.
(Bolding mine)
The title of the article may say that it's "necessary", but I think we all know that headlines aren't necessarily the most accurate version of the truth (or even what the story is really about).

What her parents make really has nothing to do with her choices. They may or may not have been able to or wanting to pay for her education. She may or may not have wanted them to do so. She's an adult. She can make her own choices.

In the article linked by popkulture, the Duke student writes:
Quote:
However, the answer is actually quite simple. I couldn't afford $60,000 in tuition, my family has undergone significant financial burden, and I saw a way to graduate from my dream school free of debt, doing something I absolutely love. Because to be clear: My experience in porn has been nothing but supportive, exciting, thrilling and empowering.
So even if it is the business of anyone other than the woman and her family, the tuition was something she felt her family couldn't afford.

As for the perks she's bought since then (from the OP):
Quote:
So, the student paper calculates, a woman who participates in one guy-on-girl scene every day for one week each month would bring home a solid annual income of $84,000.

The Daily Caller calculates that the same woman who participates in one double-penetration scene every day for one week each month would generate a much more impressive annual income of $336,000.
So she likely has more money than she needs for tuition.

From Barbara's post-
Quote:
This gal got caught out by a classmate, and when so cornered came up with this story about having to do porn as her only way of attending school. In other words, she embraced slut-shaming behaviour, in that rather than give a real reason (or none at all) she pleaded the standard excuse for any woman's making her living on her back, which was economic necessity.

Notice that she didn't announce she was doing porn to empower women or because she enjoyed it or because she saw nothing morally amiss about it. The announced reason was to be able to afford the school she was attending. And that was crock.
I can't articulate it, but to me the phrases "caught out", "cornered", and "pleaded the standard excuse for any woman's making her living on her back" just smack of judgement for her choices (aka "slut shaming").

I think what she actually said in the article speaks to her feelings about porn and women in society pretty clearly.

OP:
Quote:
Anyway, Lauren calls herself a “nerdy,” “very sexual” libertarian-leaning Republican. She wants to be a lawyer someday. For now, she is a “proud women’s studies and sociology double-major” who despises Duke’s Greek scene.

She told The Chronicle that she feels “at home” when she is in the porn world. She feels less at home when she is on the Duke campus.

“I feel like girls at Duke have to hide their sexuality,” she explained. “We’re caught in this virgin-whore dichotomy.”
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  #123  
Old 24 March 2014, 05:54 PM
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Lainie Lainie is offline
 
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There's this gotcha game, where society treats certain behavior as shameful, and then someone who doesn't consider it shameful engages in it, but keeps it quiet to avoid the hassle of being shamed, and then people say "if they weren't ashamed, why were they hiding it?"

It's kind of a mean game, IMO.
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  #124  
Old 24 March 2014, 09:29 PM
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I understand why the woman kept quiet about what she was doing. My objection, however, is that when news of it started to come out, she immediately voiced the "I had to do it out of financial necessity" explanation rather than the ones she's now giving.

I don't like deceit. I don't like spin. This woman is receiving financial aid, and her parents have in the past paid for her to attend private schools.
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  #125  
Old 25 March 2014, 12:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lainie View Post
There's this gotcha game, where society treats certain behavior as shameful, and then someone who doesn't consider it shameful engages in it, but keeps it quiet to avoid the hassle of being shamed, and then people say "if they weren't ashamed, why were they hiding it?"

It's kind of a mean game, IMO.
I agree with you, however I also get Barbara's point.. By using the excuse of "I didn't want to, I had to" (assuming it's not true, which I won't comment on at the moment) she gives the implication that doing porn is something shameful and you should only do it if you have no other realistic choice.

That is the message sent by creating an excuse about why you are doing something, that that 'something' is inherently wrong.

Of course, the world is more complicated than that; I can totally see why when all of a sudden (as opposed to her 'coming out' herself, for lack of a better phrase) it was out there to all her friends, classmates, family, etc, she decided to try to do some kind of damage control.


I could see it as being.. I guess a little bit of a coward.. However, I don't think it's completely unreasonable either nor do I think it's fair to cast too much judgement about it given there are so many variables involved (and again, that's assuming her given reasons are invented to begin with). It wasn't the ideal response, but it was a reasonable one, I think.. But then I may too be a coward.
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  #126  
Old 25 March 2014, 12:44 AM
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Originally Posted by Mickey Blue View Post
By using the excuse of "I didn't want to, I had to" . . .
Where did she say that? In one of the articles linked to she specifically said that she liked her porn work, and felt more comfortable on the set than she did at Duke.

And there's no need for an excuse unless you think you're doing something wrong. She doesn't think she did something wrong. She gave her reasons: she did the work for the money, and because she enjoyed it.
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  #127  
Old 25 March 2014, 12:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Barbara View Post
I understand why the woman kept quiet about what she was doing. My objection, however, is that when news of it started to come out, she immediately voiced the "I had to do it out of financial necessity" explanation rather than the ones she's now giving.

I don't like deceit. I don't like spin. This woman is receiving financial aid, and her parents have in the past paid for her to attend private schools.
It's only "spin" and "deceit" if one views it as being defensive.

Aside from that, I object to both her parents having given financial aid in the past and her receiving financial aid as arguments. One, that was the past, we do not know that to be the case currently. Two, financial aid includes loans, and if I had the option of paying for something out of pocket or putting it on the credit card, so to speak, I'd pay up front.
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  #128  
Old 25 March 2014, 01:18 AM
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Suppose her financial aid and assistance from her parents covered half the tuition, and she would have had to take out loans for the other half. Must she do exactly $29k worth of porn per year and then stop, or forfeit her claim that she's doing it for the tuition money? Or is it OK if she works a little more and buys herself something nice? I worked as a waitress in college to pay my rent, but with the tips I made I was also able to afford a night out every now and again, and even once bought myself a Coach purse. Was I not really working for rent money? Or is it OK because I wasn't doing sex work? Or is it OK because, even at the height of my earning capacity as a waitress, the best I could afford was one Coach purse, rather than a collection of designer handbags?
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  #129  
Old 25 March 2014, 01:28 AM
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Would anybody think her parent's previous financing of her education, or her current financial aid status, or her designer purses, would be any business of ours if she was making a bunch of money running a startup, or selling timeshares?
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  #130  
Old 25 March 2014, 01:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lainie View Post
Where did she say that? In one of the articles linked to she specifically said that she liked her porn work, and felt more comfortable on the set than she did at Duke.

And there's no need for an excuse unless you think you're doing something wrong. She doesn't think she did something wrong. She gave her reasons: she did the work for the money, and because she enjoyed it.
Ah, good point, I must have mis-read (also I completely missed the second page).
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  #131  
Old 25 March 2014, 01:40 AM
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Originally Posted by Lainie View Post
Would anybody think her parent's previous financing of her education, or her current financial aid status, or her designer purses, would be any business of ours if she was making a bunch of money running a startup, or selling timeshares?
I don't know. Selling time shares can be pretty morally questionable.
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  #132  
Old 25 March 2014, 02:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mickey Blue View Post
Ah, good point, I must have mis-read (also I completely missed the second page).
When she appeared on The View she did say she got into porn to pay her tuition:

Quote:
While Knox said her parents were supportive of her choices, Walter asked if they thought she could have done something else.

“… I’m 18 years old. I don’t have a college degree. And any job I would have gotten would not have footed the bill for $60,000 a year.”
http://blog.chron.com/hottopics/2014...cat#21262101=0
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  #133  
Old 25 March 2014, 02:08 AM
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Originally Posted by erwins View Post
I don't know. Selling time shares can be pretty morally questionable.
I chose it because it was the sleaziest sales job I could think of.
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  #134  
Old 25 March 2014, 02:30 AM
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And that may have been why she did get into it. Even if her parents footed the bills for education in the past that does not mean they were willing to continue doing so, or that they could cover all of the expense.

It is also not mutually exclusive with her finding that she liked working in porn. If you substitute just about any other occupation I am sure most people would find it very reasonable. Let's say she decided to drive a cab to cover the amount that her parents were unwilling or unable to cover, or just to avoid them having to cover it. Would it be unreasonable that she might discover that she liked the work? Would discovering that invalidate her original reason for pursuing the job?
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