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Old 12 March 2018, 04:48 PM
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Reading A brief history of US Evangelicals

Today's online version of The Atlantic (https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine...tation/554066/) has an interesting article about why so many (so called) evangelicals are so gaga about Trump.
Thought I'd share it.
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  #2  
Old 12 March 2018, 04:59 PM
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According to Jerry Falwell Jr., evangelicals have “found their dream president,” which says something about the current quality of evangelical dreams.
That's funny. This bit, OTOH, made me queasy:

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Pastor David Jeremiah has compared Jared Kushner and Ivanka Trump to Joseph and Mary: “It’s just like God to use a young Jewish couple to help Christians.”
Apparently Mr. Jeremiah believes that Jews are just tools that God uses to help (the right kind of) Christians. But he's not a bigot, of course.
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Old 12 March 2018, 05:07 PM
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Tell me about it! Some of the attitudes I read about are truly head-scratchers. As in huh?

And please for the love of all that's holy, get over the SCOTUS decision that banned prayer in public schools!

[although as long as there are tests, there will be prayer in public school!]
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Old 12 March 2018, 06:08 PM
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These are religious leaders who have spent their entire adult lives bemoaning cultural and moral decay. Yet they publicly backed a candidate who was repeatedly accused of sexual misconduct, including with a 14-year-old girl.
That's because the "cultural and moral decay" they care about is things like women being in charge of their own sexuality and the dangers of rap music. They don't want to stop old white men from molesting teenagers. Evangelicals never held any real moral highground, they just hid their hypocrisy better in the past.
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Old 12 March 2018, 06:09 PM
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Don't forget teh gays.
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Old 12 March 2018, 06:12 PM
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Doesn't women being in charge of their own sexuality cause teh gay?
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  #7  
Old 12 March 2018, 06:42 PM
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Originally Posted by DawnStorm View Post
And please for the love of all that's holy, get over the SCOTUS decision that banned prayer in public schools!
...and remember, of course, that it actually only banned organized prayer in schools. There is nothing to stop individual students from praying, as long as they aren't disrupting class while doing so. You want to pray during recess, or say grace over your cafeteria lunch, or bow your head for a moment and say a silent prayer over your Geometry final...no one is stopping you. (Well, peer pressure from other students might, but that's a different problem. And it can just as easily go in the other direction.)
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Old 12 March 2018, 08:08 PM
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Even farther than that, most of the decisions (I can't say all because there are a lot) are only against organized prayer that has an official imprimatur. Students are free to organize prayer all they want so long as school officials aren't putting de factor (or de rigueur) stamp on it.
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Old 12 March 2018, 09:49 PM
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My favorite paragraph from the article:

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For a package of political benefits, these evangelical leaders have associated the Christian faith with racism and nativism. They have associated the Christian faith with misogyny and the mocking of the disabled. They have associated the Christian faith with lawlessness, corruption, and routine deception. They have associated the Christian faith with moral confusion about the surpassing evils of white supremacy and neo-Nazism. The world is full of tragic choices and compromises. But for this man? For this cause?
I'm hoping that this will eventually sink in to a larger number of people -- not just Evangelicals, but traditional Conservatives or all kinds, and those whose distaste for some of the social agenda of the Democratic party led them to accept an alternative that is not only contrary to their economic interests, but ultimately far more destructive to the moral fabric of our society.
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Old 13 March 2018, 12:46 AM
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Originally Posted by DawnStorm View Post
Tell me about it! Some of the attitudes I read about are truly head-scratchers. As in huh?

And please for the love of all that's holy, get over the SCOTUS decision that banned prayer in public schools!

[although as long as there are tests, there will be prayer in public school!]
Not to mention(in certain areas of the country):
Pleeeeease, God, give us a snow day tomorrow!"

I may or may not have prayed that...
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  #11  
Old 13 March 2018, 01:50 AM
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The Christian Right, like the rest of the Right, made the decision years ago that they loved power and the wealth it brings above all else. The Christian Right adds a few mentions of Jesus to the mix.
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Old 13 March 2018, 02:42 AM
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The Christian Right, like the rest of the Right, made the decision years ago that they loved power and the wealth it brings above all else.
I'm not sure that's accurate.

I suspect that, for many, it's more a matter that they love, or would love, a world in which everything progressed in what they think of as its normal courses, and nobody disagreed with them about anything serious.

Quite a lot of people, of a wide variety of beliefs and opinions, would like such a world. I have days when I'd like one myself; though most of the time I think it would be boring, and nearly all the time I think it wouldn't be good for me. But whether we want it or not, none of us are going to get it; because all of us live in a world in which lots of people disagree with us, including both about serious things and about what ought to be normal courses of events.

The difference, I suppose, is that for some people that reality is just, well, reality. People are different, they're going to think different things and want to live in different ways; sometimes it's still possible to get together with them for a friendly game of scrabble or whatever, sometimes the best you can hope for is to stay out of each other's hair. But for other people, that difference is something wrong, something that needs to be fixed: if everyone's not living like they're living, it's in some way a challenge to them. And, I suppose, if one presumes there's only one right way to live, then it is a challenge: because then, if somebody's living some other way, if they're right, you must be wrong. So if you can't accept that there can be multiple right ways to live --
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Old 13 March 2018, 12:21 PM
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I think power and wealth are endemic to the politicians- and it'd be dishonest to say that doesn't affect both sides to an extent. Thorny locust, I think your explanation better explains the actions and feeilngs of the right's voting populace.

I think the distinction between the right's politicians and the voter base is important.
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  #14  
Old 13 March 2018, 12:30 PM
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Mbravo, I think you're absolutely right.
IMO a lot of "Christians" need to read what Jesus said about false prophets.
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Old 13 March 2018, 01:28 PM
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Originally Posted by DawnStorm View Post
Mbravo, I think you're absolutely right.
IMO a lot of "Christians" need to read what Jesus said about false prophets.
Also, when it comes to mandated prayer in school, they need to read what the Bible says about praying out loud.

“And when you pray, you must not be like the hypocrites. For they love to stand and pray in the synagogues [note: pretty sure this can be referring to any public building] and at the street corners, that they may be seen by others. Truly, I say to you, they have received their reward. But when you pray, go into your room and shut the door and pray to your Father who is in secret. And your Father who sees in secret will reward you."

Pray privately? Nah, can't have that! How else will everybody know what a great Christian I am?!


**

I think there's a quite simple reason why a lot of a certain type of religious person (particularly Christians) are Trump supporters: such people are more likely to be right-wing. People who are right wing are more likely to be Trump supporters. As the right-wing shifts more towards extremism and Trumpism (a very self-serving and less community-focused branch of the right), so too do the groups associated with the traditional values of the right.

There's also this prevalent attitude that the left is associated with sin and even with Satan. People were calling Obama the antichrist, for crying out loud! As this vilification got more and more vocal under Obama, it left a feeling among some people that literally *anybody* was a better choice than a Democrat. They would have voted for a pig in a wig... so they did. Once you're determined to vote for somebody it's pretty easy to slip into the habit of repeatedly justifying your choice to yourself. Cognitive dissonance is a hell of a drug.
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Old 25 June 2018, 06:01 PM
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Bumping this thread up instead of starting a new one to bring you an interesting Atlantic article on why the evangelicals elected Trump despite his many many un-Christian flaws (for lack of a better word): https://www.theatlantic.com/politics...l-fear/563558/
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  #17  
Old 25 June 2018, 06:51 PM
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and in 1973 the Supreme Court legalized abortion in Roe v. Wade. For those who saw all these things contributing to the decline of a Christian culture in the United States, there was much to fear.
Actually, opposition to abortion was at the time considered a Weird Catholic Thing. What changed it was the Moral Majority, which had previously opposed desegregation of schools: when that was no longer a viable thing to get people to join their cause for, they focused on Roe V Wade and began opposing legalized abortion. That's what really brought it out as an Evangelical political issue.
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