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  #21  
Old 28 June 2007, 08:08 PM
kismet kismet is offline
 
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Originally Posted by my2pence View Post
While I also think it is highly unlikely that you can misplace your child in that fashion, there are often reports of people who leave infants and children in cars and forget the kids are there. Is this substantially different in your opinion? Why?
This is substantially different because of the surroundings and group as well as the age of the child. As a parent, I can sometimes be lulled into a sense of normalcy in day-to-day activities. That makes it easy to forget that today the process has changed and I have the baby instead of my spouse. In situations where parents are separate, it is more possible to just assume the baby is taken care of. An amusement park is completely outside of daily life. All parents I know are on higher alert in crowded, unusual surroundings. Add to that the fact that both parents were together for an extended period of time in line-no opportunity for Dad to think Mom had the kid or vice versa. Plus, there were other kids in line with the parents. None of the kids noticed the missing sibling?

Also, this was not a newborn. It takes time to adjust to parenting, and most infants left in cars by otherwise caring parents are very young. This kid was 3 years old, these were not new parents getting used to the process.

I think everyone knew exactly where she was, maybe she was scared to go on the ride or more likely didn't want to wake from a nap. I'm betting the parents didn't purposely harm her, they probably thought she was already asleep in the stroller and was fine, would still be the same in 30 minutes or so when they got back and the kid would never know the difference. People are stupid.
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  #22  
Old 28 June 2007, 10:10 PM
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I just can't fathom leaving a child unattended like that. So many things could happen in a short amount of time, let alone an hour. The alternative, that they lost track of her is equally preposterous. It isn't like they had a dozen kids in their care (and even if they did it wouldn't be impossible to keep track of them). Most parents have a system for keeping track of their kids in public places.

That said, my parents lost me in Disney World when I was about eight. Each thought I was with the other, but it only took them about three minutes to figure it out. I was sitting right where I lost them so they found me very quickly.
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  #23  
Old 28 June 2007, 10:14 PM
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They estimate she was in the sun for 45 minutes to an hour before being found. The second article says that the parents did not come looking for her until 50 minutes after the paramedics had taken her indoors. At least, that's how I'm reading this quote: "Parents Juan Carlos, 35, and Danette Rodriguez, 32, approached park workers, seeking their daughter, about 50 minutes later."
That's almost two hours wherein neither parent thought to look for her or check on her.
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  #24  
Old 28 June 2007, 11:54 PM
Ana Ng Ana Ng is offline
 
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In their defense, that ride is srsly awesome!

Re: leaving a kid in a car, a common scenario of "forgetting" the kid seems to be an out of routine daycare drop-off. As a parent who also has adult ADHD, I get very frustrated and flighty when I can't do stuff in my routine. Many daily activities tie to the next so I don't forget important things like where I put my MetroCard or phone, et al. In that regard, I can see the very rare instance of a parent forgetting a child that way. Put the kid in the car, drive, listen to talk radio, kid falls asleep, take your normal route... horrific, yet understandable in context.

This scenario is much different. As a parent, you usually are constantly aware of your kids. This is a reason why kids can stress parents out. Louis CK touches on it in Shameless- (starts around the 1:30 mark) when you have kids, and you have them, they're not easy to forget. If I have my kids when I'm somewhere, my brain will randomly scan for them. For both parents to forget one of their kids at a family outing, that's a bit weird.
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  #25  
Old 29 June 2007, 05:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by my2pence View Post
While I also think it is highly unlikely that you can misplace your child in that fashion, there are often reports of people who leave infants and children in cars and forget the kids are there. Is this substantially different in your opinion? Why?
This is different. However, the outcome is the same -- the child suffers. I can't even imagine what they were thinking. How does a family of six go to an amusement park and five of them stand in line for that long and not realize they are missing the sixth family member? Especially after they had pushed that stroller around the park. I can't imagine forgetting my child in the car or anywhere else, for that matter. But that's just me, I'm a bit of a smothering mother.
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  #26  
Old 29 June 2007, 05:59 PM
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Wow, a bunch of good parents here. Maybe it is the stroller part of the story.

Anywhere I go, any store, any mall, any movie, I see kids of all ages roaming around without parent supervision. I recently went into the toilet at Target and there was a boy in there who was too small to "reach" the urinal without being up on his toes. I'm not good with ages but I would guess 4.
I saw no one waiting in the hall outside the toilet doors.
It's not too unusual to see a car in a parking lot with several children in it. I guess the parents think it's OK because the car is running and (just a guess) the doors are locked...and they are just going to be gone for a second.
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  #27  
Old 09 September 2007, 12:32 AM
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Hmmm... what dumbfounds ME is what a 3 yr old was doing in a stroller in the first place. Every single kid I've ever seen could walk by 2. Why didn't the kid get out and ask for help?
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  #28  
Old 13 September 2007, 04:31 PM
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Hmmm... what dumbfounds ME is what a 3 yr old was doing in a stroller in the first place. Every single kid I've ever seen could walk by 2. Why didn't the kid get out and ask for help?
Don't have kids, do you? Walking around a large theme park all day is way too much for a small child, they'll be wiped out in an hour or so. They'd need a stroller for sure after that. Also, 3-year-olds don't walk that fast, so it's much easier and faster for parents to move about the park if the kid is in a stroller.

The kid was likely asleep, 3-year-olds need naps, y'know. And what 3-year-old has the presence of mind to go ask a stranger for help? ("Don't talk to starngers!") She may have cried for Mommy or Daddy eventually, but likely the combination of a tired kid and the heat rendered her unable to do so.
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  #29  
Old 14 September 2007, 01:38 AM
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We went to Disneyland a few years ago, when DD2 was five. We borrowed a stroller from my SIL because even at 5 we knew DD2 wouldn't be able to walk all over the park for two days. We were a party of 8, me, DH, DS1, DS2, the step daughter, DD1, DD2 and my dad. We managed to ride all rides without forgetting a child anywhere.
That said, we did almost forgrt DD2 as a toddler at a relatives. I thought DS1 (14 at the time) had put her in her carseat, which was in the second seat in the van, but she was still inside playing. When we got in the car we immediately noticed the empty carseat.
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  #30  
Old 09 November 2007, 01:34 AM
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I really hate it when parents leave there children anywhere...there is no excuse!
I'll never forget the day my father took my sister and I...ages 6 and 7respectivly...to see the completion of the Boston Marathon at the finish line. In the crowd my dad had both of our hands and my sister managed to shake lose as she inspected something...my dad turned and she was GONE! My dad claimed it was only about a half hours worth of frantic seaching...but I think it was longer because a cop found my shell-shocked sister in the crowd and brought her across the street...which is why my dad couldent find her...but we did finally get her of course. I'm just saying...its obvious that it only takes a second for a child to go missing...even for the most diligent parent.

What idiot parents!!! I saw an idiot parent the other day do something stupid. I was in my ambulance getting fuel when my partner noticed a women get out of her car and leave a young child in the car seat as she walked into the store. I was really pissed and walked over to the car to see if the baby was okay...the baby noticed me making my little faces from the window outside and smiled. As I predicted...the mother was only in there a couple of minuets...but she definetly did notice the EMT standing right there with the uniform on and had a look of complete shock on her face. So i turned around and went back to my ambulance and we left.
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  #31  
Old 09 November 2007, 01:48 AM
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Tsk, Tsk

Well, maybe the shock will make her think a bit harder in the future. I saw that same thing once only the 'mother' left the engine running as well. I was soo but too much of a chicken to do anything.
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  #32  
Old 09 November 2007, 02:57 AM
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I'm sure I'm going to get clobbered for this, but is it that big of a deal to leave a kid who's strapped in a car seat, in a locked car, that's not running for less than a minute to go in and pay for gas?

I do it every now and then, because I don't want to face the get-her-out-of-the-carseat-carry-her-in-balance-on-one-hip-while-grabbing-money-cary-back-out-put-back-in-carseat dance.

I guess maybe someone COULD carjack my car, but I think this is more of that "culture of fear" stuff we live and die by.

Maybe I'm just an awful person.
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  #33  
Old 09 November 2007, 03:26 AM
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In my opinion it would depend on the weather, how long you are going to be gone, and maybe how many strange looking people are around outside.
The first two are connected -- hubby turns off the car which turns off the A/C and goes in to pay for the gas -- and it's a hot day, and there are 5 people ahead of him in line -- at least I'm big enough and healthy enough to jump out of the car and run inside where there is some A/C before my brain bakes. He catches a whole raft of crap when he does that on a hot day when we have the dogs in the van.
If you leave the car running someone might steal it and the kid, and if the car is not running someone could just grab the kid and run.
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  #34  
Old 09 November 2007, 03:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mouse goddess View Post
I'm sure I'm going to get clobbered for this, but is it that big of a deal to leave a kid who's strapped in a car seat, in a locked car, that's not running for less than a minute to go in and pay for gas?

I do it every now and then, because I don't want to face the get-her-out-of-the-carseat-carry-her-in-balance-on-one-hip-while-grabbing-money-cary-back-out-put-back-in-carseat dance.

I guess maybe someone COULD carjack my car, but I think this is more of that "culture of fear" stuff we live and die by.

Maybe I'm just an awful person.
Linky

Its illegal or soon to be illegal in half the states to leave a child in the car by themselves. I'm sure its a hassel and maybe I was a bit of a b*tch to embarress that mother the way I did but I stand by it. I don't have a child myself but I did ask my partner what he thought because he has an 8 year old and he was the one who noticed it in the first place, and he agreed with me. My god daughter is only 5 months and her mother is my best friend. She brings that girl with her everywhere...she just unlatches the car seat and goes....however, I'm convnced that she has the perfect baby because you could be using a jackhammer next to her crib and she wont wake up and cry.

Maybe I'm reaching it a little bit...maybe I'll be blessed one day with a child that does nothing but cry when there woken up...until then, I know i'd never leave a child alone in a car even for a second.
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  #35  
Old 09 November 2007, 02:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mouse goddess View Post
I'm sure I'm going to get clobbered for this, but is it that big of a deal to leave a kid who's strapped in a car seat, in a locked car, that's not running for less than a minute to go in and pay for gas?

I do it every now and then, because I don't want to face the get-her-out-of-the-carseat-carry-her-in-balance-on-one-hip-while-grabbing-money-cary-back-out-put-back-in-carseat dance.

I guess maybe someone COULD carjack my car, but I think this is more of that "culture of fear" stuff we live and die by.

Maybe I'm just an awful person.
I'll occasionally do it too. I have several conditions though. 99 % of the time will stop at one of those places where the attendant is outside right next to the pumps, and always park at the first one.That way they are at most, 10 feet away and the door is locked. If I have to go into a quicky mart, I make sure I can park directly in front of the door, and that it is uncrowded that way I can always keep my vehicle in sight and be right in/out. We take our kids to playgrounds , they get a whole lot farther away from us in those places than they are in a locked vehicle for less than a minute.
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  #36  
Old 09 November 2007, 02:44 PM
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queen of the caramels queen of the caramels is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mouse goddess View Post
I'm sure I'm going to get clobbered for this, but is it that big of a deal to leave a kid who's strapped in a car seat, in a locked car, that's not running for less than a minute to go in and pay for gas?

I do it every now and then, because I don't want to face the get-her-out-of-the-carseat-carry-her-in-balance-on-one-hip-while-grabbing-money-cary-back-out-put-back-in-carseat dance.

I guess maybe someone COULD carjack my car, but I think this is more of that "culture of fear" stuff we live and die by.

Maybe I'm just an awful person.

Especially when said child is 6 days old and it's -35C outside. There is no way I would have dragged DS out under those conditions.
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  #37  
Old 09 November 2007, 05:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelfa83 View Post
Linky

Its illegal or soon to be illegal in half the states to leave a child in the car by themselves. I'm sure its a hassel and maybe I was a bit of a b*tch to embarress that mother the way I did but I stand by it. I don't have a child myself but I did ask my partner what he thought because he has an 8 year old and he was the one who noticed it in the first place, and he agreed with me. My god daughter is only 5 months and her mother is my best friend. She brings that girl with her everywhere...she just unlatches the car seat and goes....however, I'm convnced that she has the perfect baby because you could be using a jackhammer next to her crib and she wont wake up and cry.

Maybe I'm reaching it a little bit...maybe I'll be blessed one day with a child that does nothing but cry when there woken up...until then, I know i'd never leave a child alone in a car even for a second.

Thanks for the link. I was unaware of that information.
Not to be snarky, but since you don't have a kid, and since your familiarity with babies comes from a 5mo. (I was there once too) Please know that those travel systems where you can pop out the whole seat ARE awesome, and I used it faithfully when I had it, but they usually only go up to a year. After that you have a mobile, sometimes whiny, usually heavy kid and circumstances become a little different.

I just say that because like I said, before I had a kid, I had no idea, and based all my info on friends' kids.

On Ilecks' website he has a vintage (50's) grocery store ad that shows a bunch of baby carriages, with babies in them, parked outside of the store, where presumably the mothers are inside shopping. He points out that this must have been somewhat normal at the time, weird as it seems, or the company wouldn't have included it in their ad as if it were normal, it would be too distracting as content.
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  #38  
Old 09 November 2007, 05:32 PM
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Originally Posted by mouse goddess View Post
On Ilecks' website he has a vintage (50's) grocery store ad that shows a bunch of baby carriages, with babies in them, parked outside of the store, where presumably the mothers are inside shopping. He points out that this must have been somewhat normal at the time, weird as it seems, or the company wouldn't have included it in their ad as if it were normal, it would be too distracting as content.
My mother was scolded for bringing a pram into a chemist's shop with me in it. Apparently she was supposed to leave both pram and baby outside.
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  #39  
Old 09 November 2007, 06:00 PM
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Kelfa83 Kelfa83 is offline
 
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Originally Posted by mouse goddess View Post
Thanks for the link. I was unaware of that information.
Not to be snarky, but since you don't have a kid, and since your familiarity with babies comes from a 5mo. (I was there once too) Please know that those travel systems where you can pop out the whole seat ARE awesome, and I used it faithfully when I had it, but they usually only go up to a year. After that you have a mobile, sometimes whiny, usually heavy kid and circumstances become a little different.
You're not being snarky...you've brought up a very valid point and I can understand you're side of the argument.
Yes, I'm not a mother and havent been at the front line of the battle...yet.
There are some situations where it may be in the mother's best intrest to leave the child....the weather is outrageously cold or hot and a locked, running car with heat or air conditioning may be safer an the mother can see the child from inside the store at all times.

Still...it is illegal in many states...mine being one of them and I think way too many things can happen that could be very dangerous to the child.
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  #40  
Old 09 November 2007, 06:02 PM
Doug4.7
 
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Originally Posted by Kelfa83 View Post
Its illegal or soon to be illegal in half the states to leave a child in the car by themselves.
Boy, how times have changed. I remember as a kid in SoCal where my Mom would leave all 4 of us in the car while she shopped at the store. She would let us roll down the windows and open the rear gate of our station wagon. It became a submarine in the middle of the ocean. We wouldn't leave the car as it was in the middle of the ocean.

We could play for upwards of an hour in that submarine.

Note, the windows would go up when we submerged. We weren't stupid....
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