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Old 24 December 2017, 02:32 PM
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BoKu BoKu is offline
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Location: Douglas Flat, CA
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The recidivist rate for opioid addiction is somewhere in the 70 percent. We can't keep parents sober long enough to reunify their children with them. And even those efforts come at great costs to the taxpayers, and they come at even greater costs for the children because being in this system is a trauma for children and these back-and-forth attempts in trying to reunify them with their parents is scarring these children.
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Old 24 December 2017, 03:49 PM
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UEL UEL is offline
Join Date: 01 August 2004
Location: Fredericton, Canada
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My brother works in addictions in Vancouver, and has for years. He and I talk quite a bit about it (it's a world I have zero experience in, and he has built his career around it) and I brought up this thread topic.

He said that it is common among the workers in the industry that it takes on average 16 times for an addict to be placed into recovery (which comes before rehabilitation) before any treatment sticks. The addict most often falls back into addiction or dies before treatment can take.

One of my cousins in Toronto hit exactly the 16 mark before recovery took and he is now 18 months sober. But I do find it hard knowing that it takes 16 times before half of the people have taken to recovery. It is a bit of a discouraging number.
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Old 24 December 2017, 04:38 PM
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erwins erwins is offline
Join Date: 04 April 2006
Location: Portland, OR
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Originally Posted by thorny locust View Post
Say what?

Do they have any actual evidence of that? that is, not evidence that it dissuades a few people, but evidence that the overall likelihood of its causing damage is reduced?

-- oh, silly me. The people deciding to put it in there are quite possibly only nominally interested in reducing the physical damage; they're primarily interested in 'but it's an opiate/it's illegal! killing a few extra druggies is worth it if it keeps a few different people from taking it at all!'
In this context, "abuse" is about taking a narcotic for something other than it was prescribed, by a person who got it illicitly. It is aimed at recreational use of scheduled drugs, and it really has nothing to do with how dangerous a drug is.

I said it probably does reduce abuse (of hydrocodone--not of scheduled drugs in general) because people will choose, or will be steered by dealers to, the "safer" drugs when they are available. You hear a lot more about oxycontin abuse than Vicodin. I'm sure some people get started with Vicodin, and I'm sure many addicts will take it in excess when it is all they can get. But there is a reason that you wouldn't hear of any but the most desperate alcoholic drinking denatured alcohol now.

That does not make it right that something is added that can kill or cause permanent injury, for the purpose of discouraging abuse. Because of course it won't always work.

As does aspirin, of course. I'm careful with my dosages on both.

I'm not taking ibuprofen (when I need it, which is only occasionally) instead of tylenol because I think it's less toxic, though it may be slightly so; I'm taking it because, on me, ibuprofen actually works (at least on headaches) and tylenol doesn't do a thing.
AIUI Acetaminophen has a much narrower zone between a therapeutic dose and a damaging dose, and the damage it does can be permanent. Ibuprofen can be very useful at the OTC dosage, which is pretty far from the amount that will typically cause problems, and the problems it does cause, at least initially, tend to be reversible.

Like you, I tend to get less benefit from Acetaminophen, so my go to is ibuprofen. When I do need to use Acetaminophen, I am very careful about it.

Last edited by erwins; 24 December 2017 at 04:49 PM.
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Old 24 December 2017, 05:36 PM
RichardM RichardM is offline
Join Date: 27 March 2004
Location: Las Cruces, NM
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Those few times I've taken opiates, I got constipated. Just this week, I was feeling my arthritis some what more than usual so I took ibuprofen instead of my usual aspirin. I got plugged up for a couple of days. Back to aspirin.
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Old 06 March 2018, 02:04 PM
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DawnStorm DawnStorm is offline
Join Date: 11 March 2003
Location: Montgomery County, MD
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Originally Posted by RichardM View Post
Those few times I've taken opiates, I got constipated. Just this week, I was feeling my arthritis some what more than usual so I took ibuprofen instead of my usual aspirin. I got plugged up for a couple of days. Back to aspirin.
That's the main reason why DH wants no part of opiates for his back pain. Well that and the fear of addiction. I once suggested that if he went the opiate route, I would monitor him and keep the meds with me and dole them out as indicated by the scrip, but he still said no because constipation.
I still can't believe he's more worried about being backed up than drugged up. Thankfully the Neurontin works for him.
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Old 07 March 2018, 01:06 PM
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Lainie Lainie is offline
Join Date: 29 August 2005
Location: Suburban Columbus, OH
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IDK, I didn't experience severe constipation until about 10 years ago, and I was unpleasantly surprised to learn just how painful it can be.
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