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#1
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A Dallas man was killed late Thursday when a police officer returning home from her shift entered the wrong apartment in her building and eventually opened fire, authorities said.
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news...shoots-n907411 |
#2
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I'm trying very hard not to rush to judgement here. I'm not being very successful. The fact that this has been reported as the officer thinking she was entering her own apartment, and the absence of other details, makes almost any attempt to justify the shooting sound silly. Of course, even if it's later revealed that she wasn't mistaken, or that the man she shot was acting in a clearly unwarranted aggressive way, this cop is going to look very guilty.
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#3
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I'm curious what specifically you think she is guilty of? (I'm not expressing an opinion, just asking the question).
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#4
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Well presumable an average civilian would probably be considered for breaking and entering and second degree murder for something like this taken at face value. I.E. entering a person's home and killing them.
I'm not sure how much being a police officer not answering to any official call mitigates that. Personally, "Opps, I thought this was my house" does not carries much weight. P.S. Large grain of salt as all opinions expressed are based only on headlines and the main talking points I have heard. More details could easily change these thoughts. |
#5
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For me, it's what is expressed by the mother of the victim...
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I will now end my rant with an inappropriate joke... "Many Bothams died to bring us this information" ![]() |
#6
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I'm not saying I'm convinced this is the case, I'm saying the way the story is being reported makes one jump to that conclusion. It sounds like she came home, opened the door to the wrong apartment, saw a stranger she assumed to be an intruder in her own apartment, and shot him dead. Some of the comments above appear to be based on these assumptions. The actual facts may be (or may not be) something different. |
#7
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I haven't taken time to think it through, but it was not immediately apparent to me what crime would apply. (This doesn't mean I think no crime would -- I just want to think through the.elements). I do think that the fact that she is an officer is almost completely irrelevant. |
#8
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According to this article the police are seeking manslaughter charges against the officer.
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#9
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I think some form of trespassing charge might apply to her entering the apartment in the first place. In my understanding, breaking and entering requires intent to commit a crime, but trespass doesn't necessarily require intent. |
#10
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Did these apartments come pre-furnished with the same furniture? That seems unlikely. |
#11
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She probably didn't really notice the furniture. The door was most likely not locked, which might have made her nervous when she realized that her apartment was not secured. She opened the door to her apartment, saw a strange man there, pulled and shot him. That is incredibly bad police work on her part, since she went straight for lethal force when there is no indication that he started anything. I really, really hope police officers are not trained to shoot first, ask questions later.
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#12
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Not that I think it matters much at this point (though depending on the circumstances, who knows, particularly when fine points of law end up before a jury) but where are you getting those details from? She entered the wrong apartment, she shot the rightful occupant; those are the only details I’ve been able to gleam about what went on inside. Did I miss something with more details about what happened in between those two events?
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#13
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That is precisely what they're trained to do--aside from the part about ever asking questions--at least in much of the United States.
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#14
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No it isn't. It is absurd to suggest that it is. |
#15
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No Avril, that is not correct in any way shape or form. I have been through an abbreviated police training course as part of qualifying for CERT (Community Emergency Response Service) that included a simulated shooting scenario. During my time trying to catch the bad guy (thought to have robbed a store at gun point), I shot him 4 times when he jumped out of hiding. Afterwards, I could not even remember if he displayed his weapon. I think he did as my partner also fired his weapon. The officer playing the bad guy looked very put out and had 5 paint splotches on him as we walked out. But I still don't know if he displayed a weapon or just hollered boo.
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#16
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I'm not saying Avril is correct, but I'm wondering how your anecdote about CERT contradicts her position. How were you evaluated on the training exercise given the way it played out? Was an alternative approach suggested? Not being snarky, seriously asking here.
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#17
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I live in a block of 8 apartments. When I first moved in about 20 years ago all the apartments had the same doors. That is a screened wrought iron door and wooden door. All pretty much identical*.
I went to the local hardware store to get a copy of both door keys to have a spare set and for the screen door he just picked a pre-cut one of the shelf from a selection of about five. The wooden door has the "proper" lock. I just double checked and our front doors do have numbers but the are at the very top of the door and unless you are looking for them I doubt you would notice them. On one occasion I walked up an extra flight of steps and it wasn't until I looked the door and thought "That not my door!" that I realised. I was tired. Another time I heard some trying to unlock my front door. It was the upstairs neighbour. He apologised when I opened the door to see what the heck was happening, I must have given him a look, but as a woman who lives alone I was understandable nervous. Now unusually for buildings of this size and age, this is a secure building, you need a key to get in. So in summer many people leave the wooden door open and just lock the screen door to get flow through of air. So, basically I can understand how this happened. Or at least how she got in. *That has since changed. |
#18
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I told of my experience to try and explain the stress of being in a situation like that the police may face. |
#19
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Does Texas have a "Stand Your Ground" Law? Because if the guy in the apartment came after her, she could shoot him and claim self defence.
It may not convince a jury, but it may. |
#20
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Texas has had a variety of gun laws. In the fictional westerns, the sheriff would tell the cowboys to check their guns before going into town. I'm not sure but I think this was true. I do know the 1886 Texas constitution banned concealed carry for everyone except police. There were lots of exceptions such as need. Thus when I had to go to Fair Park in Dallas after dark to study the lighting, I was legal to carry a firearm as the park was a hot bed of drug dealing. Plus the lighting designer who I was going with had been held up there previously. She said she would not go unless I was carrying a gun. Texas allows shooting in defense of property if it is dark but not if it is daylight. This allowed a guy to get away with killing a woman who he had payed for a sex act. When she backed out and left, he went outside in the dark and killed her but got off because it was dark. Self defense has always been an acceptable reason to shoot. Today I'm not sure if there is a 'stand your ground' law similar to Florida's. Open carry is now legal but I think it requires the same training as previously for concealed carry. My license read 'Right to Carry', not 'Concealed Carry,'
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