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Old 12 August 2017, 09:54 PM
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Blow Your Top 1 dead, 19 injured as car hits crowd after a 'Unite the Right' rally in Charlottesvil

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/...tue/561833001/

Quote:
CHARLOTTESVILLE — One person was killed and at least 19 injured Saturday when a car crashed into a crowd of peaceful protesters leaving a "Unite the Right" rally that officials declared an "unlawful assembly." State officials said the driver was in custody.

This is shocking and heartbreaking. There's footage of the attack from several different angles and it was very clearly deliberate.

Internet 'sleuths' tried to trace the driver via the licence plate and decided that a kid in Michigan called Joel VanGheluwe was the culprit and have latched onto the fact that he's left-leaning and anti-Trump, regardless of the fact that he's currently posting online and the driver of the car is currently in police custody and wouldn't have internet access so they can't be the same person.

Last edited by Gutter Monkey; 12 August 2017 at 10:13 PM.
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  #2  
Old 12 August 2017, 10:07 PM
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A state police helicopter has also crashed in Charlottesville, with two confirmed dead.

http://www.dailyprogress.com/news/lo...df74aca4c.html
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  #3  
Old 12 August 2017, 10:09 PM
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The stories I'm reading say that the car drove into counter-protesters rather than the rally itself:

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...otest-violence

So if the driver is "left-leaning" then presumably he hit the wrong lot. (Not that I'd even start to believe the internet sleuthing. Where have you seen that?)

At least Trump has fairly straightforwardly condemned the violence, although even that seems to have been too much for David Duke, according to some of his tweets reminding Trump "who elected him".
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  #4  
Old 12 August 2017, 10:12 PM
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We don't know if the driver is left-leaning or not, the person that the "internet sleuths" identified is the wrong person
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Old 12 August 2017, 10:17 PM
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Yes, I know. I was just saying that the events suggest, if anything, that his politics lean in the other direction. He targeted the counter-protesters, not the main rally.

(eta) I have to say, I don't see why you even mentioned that, let alone repeated the wrong name, given it's clearly false and irrelevant. I know you weren't saying it was true, but why even repeat the name? Maybe the rest of it as a side point...
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  #6  
Old 12 August 2017, 10:28 PM
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The name has already been posted in dozens and dozens of websites and is all over Twitter.

The person who was named is rolling with it (his FB page is getting trolled pretty hard) and is posting links to his music on his FB page for all the new visitors

Last edited by Gutter Monkey; 12 August 2017 at 10:41 PM.
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Old 12 August 2017, 10:55 PM
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so I am probably going to ramble a bit here ...

I took my degree from the University of Virginia in 1985
so I lived in Charlottesville for 4 years (1981 to 1985)
those were very happy years for me

but seeing these photos of people marching with torches about the ground of the University is very unsettling
especially the photos of the counter-protesters surrounded as they circled the statue of Thomas Jefferson, which is on the 'outside' of the Rotunda -- the Rotunda being the emblem of the University, the central Grounds
the Grounds are open & connect seamlessly with Charlottesville

during my years at the University there were issues of racism, particularly regarding one fraternity at the University
that fraternity had an 'old South' affect & celebrated it ... in particular hanging the 'stars & bars' from its balcony on football weekends

this is just so weird for me to see these images

still, southern/western Virginia is part of the 'old South'
Richmond -- about an hour east of Charlottesville -- was the capitol of the Confederacy
when I lived there I was struck by the obvious racism in Charlottesville & in some pockets of the University

since the age of 9 years, my family had lived in northern Virginia -- across the river from Washington DC ...
we moved there after living in Vicksburg, Mississippi, for 4 years
my father was an Army officer hence the various locations
& now, my eldest brother & his wife (her family is from Mississippi), & a sister of mine live in Mississippi, & my sister, who died in 2001, is buried in Mississippi

&, to go off on another goofy connection, my mother grew up outside of the United States Military Academy (USMA, West Point, NY) ... & my father graduated from the Academy (1954) & I was born there (1963)
& USMA was established by Thomas Jefferson in 1802
& I also worked there from 1985 to 1990 & again from 2001 to 2004

Robert E Lee was a graduate of the Academy as well as a Superintendent
& one of the cadet barracks is named after him -- Lee Barracks -- done after the American Civil War
& I asked once why a cadet barracks was named after someone who committed treason against his country ...

anyway, these protests are associated with the decision by the City of Charlottesville to remove a statute of Robert E Lee from a city park

& in another weird connection for me, the Detroit Red Wings, my hockey team, issued a statement condemning the protests because a group from Michigan had the winged wheel logo of the team on their items -- protesters from Michigan who would be described as white nationalists

just all this stuff scrambling my brain these past hours
& all these weird connections
& I so enjoyed my years in Charlottesville & seeing these photos & reading the news ... it is all a bit much to process for me

and another thing, my best friend, also a UVa graduate, has 3 nephews who will bring another year next weekend -- when the students return for classes
her son also graduated from the University in 2015

I am glad the students -- all the students -- are not there at this time
however, I don't think this is the end of the protests in Charlottesville

it is all too much
all this anger & hate
I don't understand
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  #8  
Old 12 August 2017, 11:21 PM
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From articles on this : Trump condemned "this egregious display of hatred, bigotry and violence on many sides." He can't even out and out condemn white supremacists. Those pesky "many sides" were the real problem. I'm awaiting his tweet blaming Clinton.
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  #9  
Old 12 August 2017, 11:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sue View Post
I'm awaiting his tweet blaming Clinton.
If race is involved, I suspect he'll blame Obama.
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  #10  
Old 13 August 2017, 04:15 AM
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Well, it's a good thing several states have been anticipating this problem by proposing bills making it legal to run down protesters...
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  #11  
Old 13 August 2017, 06:14 AM
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Everyone hates Illinois Nazis.
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  #12  
Old 13 August 2017, 06:19 AM
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The police have released the name and the mug shot of the man arrested for hitting the counter-protestors with his car

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/...ack/562760001/
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  #13  
Old 13 August 2017, 06:50 AM
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The president and their ilk are afraid of saying "terrorists" when it really matters.
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  #14  
Old 13 August 2017, 08:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gutter Monkey View Post
The police have released the name and the mug shot of the man arrested for hitting the counter-protestors with his car

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/...ack/562760001/
"Here's What We Know About The Man Accused Of Killing A Woman At A White Supremacist Rally" Buzzfeed 12 August 2017
Quote:
Fields is registered as a Republican and voted in the November election, as well as in Ohio's primary election this March, according to public records.

{ snip }

An image circulated by the Anti-Defamation League appeared to show Fields standing with members of Vanguard America, a white nationalist group that helped organize the protest.

{ snip }

On a Facebook page that appears to belong to Fields, photos included memes embraced by the alt right and some supporters of President Donald Trump, including Pepe the Frog and a portrait of a crowned Trump sitting on a throne.
This has been claimed to be his Twitter account. One one hand it's consistent with the pro Trump/alt right Facebook page shown in the Buzzfeed article. However, the fact it hasn't been disabled by Twitter makes me suspicious.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gutter Monkey View Post
Internet 'sleuths' tried to trace the driver via the licence plate and decided that a kid in Michigan called Joel VanGheluwe was the culprit and have latched onto the fact that he's left-leaning and anti-Trump, regardless of the fact that he's currently posting online and the driver of the car is currently in police custody and wouldn't have internet access so they can't be the same person.
From the Southern Poverty Law Center (SPLC):
Quote:
The suspect was arrested nearby. Although far-right internet trolls initially claimed that the driver was an “anti-Trump open borders Bernie Sanders supporter” based on a mistaken identity dredged up from Reddit, James Alex Fields was later identified as the driver of the car and is being held without bail on charges of second degree murder, one count of hit-and-run, attended failure to stop with injury and three counts of malicious wounding. He will be arraigned before a judge on Monday.
While I love the SPLC I think they're being much too charitable. If it originated on Reddit I doubt that it was a case of mistaken identity. I think it's much more likely that it was intentional. (And I see alt right trolls are still passing false information.)

Brian
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  #15  
Old 13 August 2017, 03:03 PM
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Yeah, that was pretty obviously deliberate on their part.
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  #16  
Old 13 August 2017, 04:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sue View Post
From articles on this : Trump condemned "this egregious display of hatred, bigotry and violence on many sides." He can't even out and out condemn white supremacists. Those pesky "many sides" were the real problem.
Exactly. I nearly hit the ceiling when I saw that quote.

It goes right along with the sort of "apology" that amounts to 'I'm sorry that you were so wrong!'


-- if he said the same sort of thing when terrorists are or claim to be Muslim, I might give him a pass. But, of course, he doesn't.
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  #17  
Old 13 August 2017, 05:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thorny locust View Post
Exactly. I nearly hit the ceiling when I saw that quote.

It goes right along with the sort of "apology" that amounts to 'I'm sorry that you were so wrong!'


-- if he said the same sort of thing when terrorists are or claim to be Muslim, I might give him a pass. But, of course, he doesn't.
..... and completely predictably, Richard Spencer's reaction on Twitter was:
Quote:
Did Trump just denounce antifa?
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  #18  
Old 13 August 2017, 11:49 PM
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http://reverepress.com/news/charlott...getting-fired/

Quote:
Twitter user @YesYoureRacist, who describes their work as “scouring the underbelly of Twitter to expose people who say they’re not racist, and then go on to prove otherwise,” is posting the identities of those who attended far-right rallies on Friday and Saturday
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  #19  
Old 14 August 2017, 12:30 AM
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Yeah, what does it say about Trump that he can't even say, "Nazis are bad," aka a sentiment that most people agree with and is about as controversial as saying Washington D.C. is the United States capitol?

:sighs: This administration keeps making me long for the villainy of Richard Nixon. If given a choice between competent malice and incompetent malice, I'd much prefer the first. Ideally, you'd have no malice, but unfortunately, when it comes to the GOP, that doesn't seem to be an option.

As I keep saying, the modern GOP has all the prejudices of their predecessors but none of the work ethic.
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  #20  
Old 14 August 2017, 01:52 AM
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Alex Jones Calls Charlottesville Violence a False Flag, Because Alternative Facts Are Still a Thing

Quote:
George Soros did it. Or maybe it was the Deep State. That was the reaction of the far right to Saturday’s violence in Charlottesville, Virginia, which left three dead. Even as images played on television of James Alex Fields, Jr., plowing his car into a crowd protesting the Unite the Right rally, a counter-narrative was coalescing on the Internet that offered a competing reality, one that had little grounding in confirmable fact.
"Little" grounding?
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