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  #1  
Old 25 April 2014, 09:41 PM
Ryda Wong, EBfCo. Ryda Wong, EBfCo. is offline
 
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Default Boy stabs, kills girl who turned down prom date

Quote:
A 16-year-old girl was assaulted and killed by a classmate Friday morning at a Milford, Connecticut, high school, apparently because she turned down his invitation to the senior prom, local media reported.
http://kdvr.com/2014/04/25/boy-stabs...own-prom-date/

Nah. We don't live in a misogyny-riddled society at all!
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  #2  
Old 25 April 2014, 09:49 PM
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I don't disagree that there is a huge problem with sexism in society, but I think it's at best premature (since the whole prom thing is based on a rumor per the article) and at worst wrong to suggest that this is indicative of that.

People kill (or otherwise harm) one another for seemingly stupid reasons, I think it's totally reasonable that even if the reason was cause of 'prom' that her being a woman is incidental.

I'm not saying it can't be because if misogyny.. Just that I think you are wearing your bias on your sleeve by assuming it's related to it and not just some nut to stabbed somebody.
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  #3  
Old 25 April 2014, 10:26 PM
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Is it unfairly prejudicial against men to suggest that men might kill women under these or similar circumstances (or indeed, any circumstances) far more often than women kill men?

Maybe women are just better at killing people discreetly and concealing their crimes...
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  #4  
Old 25 April 2014, 10:37 PM
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It is worth noting that men tend to be more violent towards everyone. Women may sometimes present a target of opportunity, or some women are less likely to effectively fight back, but men simply choose violence as a tool to fix problems (real and perceived) more often than women, and more often than they should. It'd be just as wrong if this guy shot the sandwich artist who put the wrong cheese on his sub - senseless, meaningless, unprovoked violence. And men do that to men, women, animals, inanimate objects (how often have you heard of a woman punching a hole in the wall?), and so on?

One of the arguments I have against that whole "an armed society is a polite society" is that we should be doing things for the right reasons, and not simply for fear of the consequences. I should have respect for my neighbour and neither invade his house, nor attack him - it should not be the fear of them using deadly force on me, which prevents me from initiating that attack.

Not too long ago here we discussed victim impact statements in sentencing, and it was considered that the penalty for murder should be no lower if the victim was not popular, attractive, well-known, or even well-loved. Murder is murder, is it not?
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  #5  
Old 25 April 2014, 10:39 PM
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Still seems like a pretty bold claim to jump to when all we know for sure is a boy killed a girl.
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  #6  
Old 25 April 2014, 10:49 PM
Ryda Wong, EBfCo. Ryda Wong, EBfCo. is offline
 
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The reason he killed her is the part that points strongly to misogyny
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  #7  
Old 25 April 2014, 10:51 PM
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The reason being the rumor among a bunch of high school students?

Quote:
The police chief didn’t provide a motive. Investigators are looking into rumors a boy was angry because Sanchez had declined to go to the prom with him, News 12 reported. The prom, scheduled for Friday night, has been postponed.
Even if it's true, people do terrible things to other people they are angry at often, how are we to know that her being female wasn't simply incidental?
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  #8  
Old 25 April 2014, 10:57 PM
Ryda Wong, EBfCo. Ryda Wong, EBfCo. is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mickey Blue View Post
Even if it's true, people do terrible things to other people they are angry at often, how are we to know that her being female wasn't simply incidental?
Because the idea that it's OK to be angry at someone for refusing a man's advances is an age-old part of misogyny
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  #9  
Old 25 April 2014, 11:57 PM
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We don't know why he reacted that way. It could be an untreated mental illness, drugs, a general violent tendency...we don't even know if it was premeditated murder and we don't know the reason or the details. We don't know if he has ever been violent to anyone else, male or female. My first thought upon hearing the story was not misogyny but "this boy needs psychiatric help".

It bothers me that the majority of comments I've read regarding the story focus on the fact that he brought a knife to school, rather than the fact that he reacted with violence. According to some reports, he first strangled the girl and threw her down a flight of stairs, so we don't even know if the stabbing was the ultimate cause of death.
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  #10  
Old 26 April 2014, 12:02 AM
jimmy101_again jimmy101_again is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryda Wong, EBfCo. View Post
Because the idea that it's OK to be angry at someone for refusing a man's advances is an age-old part of misogyny
Really? I guess my "Misogyny for Idiots" book missed that part of the training.
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  #11  
Old 26 April 2014, 12:09 AM
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Aimee Evilpixie Aimee Evilpixie is offline
 
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The rolling eyes don't really make sense, because men's entitlement to women's time and attention is a major part of misogyny. See Nice Guys. And street harassment. And a million billion other little things.
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  #12  
Old 26 April 2014, 12:18 AM
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Not to mention the whole "I have a headache" concept. I'm not entirely sure you read all of your "Misogyny for Idiots" book very carefully.
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  #13  
Old 26 April 2014, 12:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryda Wong, EBfCo. View Post
The reason he killed her is the part that points strongly to misogyny
Or maybe he has poor impulse control (or other related problems) and would have lashed out similarly at anyone (of any gender) whom he felt had rejected him.
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  #14  
Old 26 April 2014, 01:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmy101_again View Post
Really? I guess my "Misogyny for Idiots" book missed that part of the training.
Maybe you should have read a book designed for non-idiots.
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  #15  
Old 26 April 2014, 02:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryda Wong, EBfCo. View Post
The reason he killed her is the part that points strongly to misogyny
We do not know the reason. We have rumors.
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  #16  
Old 26 April 2014, 01:55 PM
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He supposedly asked her on the morning of the prom and she already had plans to go with someone else which is a wee bit odd to say the least.
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  #17  
Old 26 April 2014, 04:10 PM
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A Turtle Named Mack A Turtle Named Mack is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by firefighter_raven View Post
He supposedly asked her on the morning of the prom and she already had plans to go with someone else which is a wee bit odd to say the least.
Which led me to wonder if the attacker did not have some sort of mental/emotional problems - any guy would have to anticipate that the girl he was about to ask would have other plans, unless he knew her well enough to know better. So he apparently did not know her all that well, did not anticipate that she had other plans and then got agitated because she did have plans, At least this is what the story tells us so far. Unless there is more to the story (which of course we all expect), then the guy has bigger emotional problems than just thinking he is God's gift to women (if he thought anything along those lines at all).

ETA: I searched further articles and got more description of the attack:
Sanchez was attacked, allegedly by Plaskon, around 7:15 a.m. Friday, when the boy shoved the girl down a set of stairs and started to choke her, witnesses told the Daily News.
Maren Sanchez from FB ... dressed for the prom Maren Sanchez modeled her marine blue, floor-length gown on Facebook last month. She planned to wear it to Friday's junior prom.

Quote:
The teen pulled out a kitchen knife he brought from home and slashed Sanchez across the neck, chest and face. She was pronounced dead at 7:43 a.m.
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/crim...icle-1.1769402

If the attacker brought a knife from home, it seems to me he had intentions of violence before he even spoke with Sanchez.

Last edited by A Turtle Named Mack; 26 April 2014 at 04:38 PM.
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  #18  
Old 26 April 2014, 04:29 PM
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Aimee Evilpixie Aimee Evilpixie is offline
 
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Well, having serious emotional problems plus a big truckload of misogyny is something common to a lot of serial killers who prey/ed on women. Like the Green River Killer.

I'm not saying that this kid is a serial killer in the making or that his motivation was 100% misogyny-based, just pointing out that it's entirely possible for emotional problems and misogyny to have a horrible, horrible team-up.
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  #19  
Old 26 April 2014, 05:12 PM
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Yep. I would think that its possible for mental instability to be influenced in a particular direction by social issues, rhetoric, etc. Another example is all the kooky people who latch onto conspiracy theories, or sovereign citizen type movements. Having dealt with a number of the latter, I can tell you that there are definitely mental issues at work, and latching onto the sovereign citizen crap gives it a direction and a purpose. The person was probably going to have mental issues no matter what, but the exact form they would take is open to outside influence. There are a lot of men whose mental issues take the form of obsession with/hatred for women (sometimes just one woman, or one at a time). I don't think that is just random happenstance.
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  #20  
Old 26 April 2014, 05:28 PM
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While I agree that it sounds like this kid is misogynistic as ****, I'm not sure that speaks to the misogyny of the society as a whole, any more than the DC sniper shootings speaks to the violence of African-Americans. Don't get me wrong, there are lots and lots of other reasons why you could make a really good claim for society being like this but isolated wackjobs != data.
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