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  #1  
Old 19 July 2007, 02:47 AM
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No Road to New Life After Katrina Is Closed to Many

For thousands of evacuees, going home to New Orleans has become a vague and receding dream. Living in bleak circumstances, they cannot afford to go back, or have nothing to go back to. Over the two years since Hurricane Katrina hit, the shock of evacuation has hardened into the grim limbo of exile.

http://www.theledger.com/article/200...YT02/707120538
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  #2  
Old 19 July 2007, 04:03 PM
Elkhound Elkhound is offline
 
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The answer is to pull up your socks and build a new life for yourself elsewhere, and displaced persons have for generations. Refugees after WWII came to this country with little more than the clothing on their backs not even speaking the language, and most of them did pretty well for themselves here; and their children after them. NO refugees are at least (mostly) US citizens who speak the language; it should be a lot easier for them.
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Old 19 July 2007, 05:17 PM
kismet kismet is offline
 
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Originally Posted by Elkhound View Post
The answer is to pull up your socks and build a new life for yourself elsewhere, and displaced persons have for generations. Refugees after WWII came to this country with little more than the clothing on their backs not even speaking the language, and most of them did pretty well for themselves here; and their children after them. NO refugees are at least (mostly) US citizens who speak the language; it should be a lot easier for them.
Oh, come on. Did you read the article? Have you met any evacuees, or visited the places where they now live?

The people who are having the most trouble are very poor people who survived day-to-day by relying on networks of friends and family, networks that have been scattered. They have been dropped off in environments that don't have public transportation, and local employers are unwilling to hire them. Many of these people are older and not necessarily in good health. Their options are limited.

Maybe their children will have adapted and adjusted to the new location, but I doubt WW2 refugees were dancing and singing in the streets 2 years after being ripped from their homes and losing their family networks and everything they had known.
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Old 20 July 2007, 12:52 AM
Elkhound Elkhound is offline
 
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Oh, come on. Did you read the article? Have you met any evacuees, or visited the places where they now live?
Yes. There are several living right in my neighborhood as a matter of fact.

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Maybe their children will have adapted and adjusted to the new location, but I doubt WW2 refugees were dancing and singing in the streets 2 years after being ripped from their homes and losing their family networks and everything they had known.
Not dancing and singing in the streets, but I'm sure they knew that they were a great deal better off here than where they came from, and from what I have read and heard they concentrated on building a new life for themselves rather than mourning for the old.
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  #5  
Old 23 July 2007, 02:55 PM
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My question is this: How long is FEMA supposed to support the "evacuees"? It has been almost two years since the storm. That is plenty of time to (1)find a job, even if it is flipping burgers at a fast food joint, (2)begin to at least partially support yourself. [I have no issue with the government helping you if you are also trying to help yourself]

If they want to go back to NO, there are resources to allow that to happen. FDR developed this wonderful thing called the Interstate Highway System, that connects all of the major cities across the country. NO is even included in that, via I-10 and I-12.
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Old 24 July 2007, 03:18 AM
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Originally Posted by Griffin2020 View Post
My question is this: How long is FEMA supposed to support the "evacuees"? It has been almost two years since the storm. That is plenty of time to (1)find a job, even if it is flipping burgers at a fast food joint, (2)begin to at least partially support yourself. [I have no issue with the government helping you if you are also trying to help yourself]

If they want to go back to NO, there are resources to allow that to happen. FDR developed this wonderful thing called the Interstate Highway System, that connects all of the major cities across the country. NO is even included in that, via I-10 and I-12.
If you have no car and do not have the means to buy one all the wonderful interstates in the world aren't going to be much help.

Anyway, I thought the article made it pretty clear why most of these people are still needing help. Just one example:

Quote:
JoAnn Anderson needs a job.

She has filled out applications and taken drug tests. She has asked people who are already employed for help. A hotel housekeeper for 22 years in New Orleans, she has called every hotel and motel in the hotel and motel section of the Memphis Yellow Pages. They are not interested.

“I keep calling them back,” Ms. Anderson said. “Once I get started working, I know they would like me because I know I do my best and I do my job. I want to work. I don’t want to just sit around getting my bones all old and everything.”

Ms. Anderson, 53, and her longtime companion, Jeffery Evans, 52, are in the category of people for whom recovery is furthest from reach. Near the end of their working lives, unappealing to employers, yet financially unable to retire, many are on the brink of ruin — or will be when their federal disaster assistance runs out.
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  #7  
Old 24 July 2007, 01:31 PM
Malruhn Malruhn is offline
 
 
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Poor JoAnn. She doesn't want a "job" - she wants a "job that meets all of her expectations and requirements." Okay, so housekeeping jobs are full - try applying to be a phreaking WAITRESS. I would bet that McDonalds is hiring as well. If she always does "her best" and wants to work, within a year she could be on her way to management.

That's something that has always bothered me. People claim they want jobs, but then set their standards so high - or put so many deliminators (or Eliminators) that they can't work. Kind of like my sister who bitches that she can't find a man... but there is only one Jude Law in existance, and he's taken... but she still bitches and won't change her standards.

If you NEED a job, there is work out there. It may not be pretty, and it may not be in what you WANT to do, but it is a job.
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Old 24 July 2007, 01:50 PM
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My point exactly, Malruhn. Wal-Mart is hiring...Wal-Mart is ALWAYS hiring. They may not have the highest pay or best benfits in the world, but they do pay, and they do offer insurance and other benefits.

I work in IT. When the Tech Sector crashed here, I could not find a job in IT. Did I say screw it, and sit around expecting the government to pay my way? Of course not. I went out and got a job waiting tables. A paycheck is a paycheck, and there is no job "below your dignity".
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  #9  
Old 24 July 2007, 02:02 PM
Ryda Wong, EBfCo. Ryda Wong, EBfCo. is offline
 
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Originally Posted by Griffin2020 View Post
A paycheck is a paycheck, and there is no job "below your dignity".
I'm sure dignity is the issue with JoAnn. Because everyone knows that cleaning jizz-stained sheets and shitty toilets is a job full of dignity and status.


Folks, the economy now is far, far different than it was in WWII. Comparing circumstances between the two times is a bit silly.

Now, granted, some of these folks might be able to get some work. And I can't access the article for some reason, but do these benefits still apply if you are working at all? Many times, dramatic cuts in subsistance monies apply if you have employment.
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Old 24 July 2007, 02:05 PM
Ryda Wong, EBfCo. Ryda Wong, EBfCo. is offline
 
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Finally got it to open. In the case of JoAnne and her partner:

Quote:
For months, they searched the unfamiliar city for work — she at hotels, he at temporary agencies and, when that failed, at fast-food restaurants.

In May, Mr. Evans finally found a warehouse job near downtown. The bus ride takes so long that he leaves the house at 5 a.m. to get there by 7. He earns $6 an hour.

But Mr. Evans is not complaining. “I’ve been trying to get a job forever,” he said, “so I’m very, very satisfied that I got a job like that.”
So, yeah, guys. They took your "advice." Now what?
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  #11  
Old 24 July 2007, 02:11 PM
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Originally Posted by Griffin2020 View Post
My point exactly, Malruhn. Wal-Mart is hiring...Wal-Mart is ALWAYS hiring. They may not have the highest pay or best benfits in the world, but they do pay, and they do offer insurance and other benefits.
Do you two seriously contend that these people are overlooking "undignified' jobs? The bottom line for Joann is at 53 it is damn hard to get any job if you are unskilled. And often even if you are. That's reality folks.
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  #12  
Old 24 July 2007, 03:06 PM
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Originally Posted by Elkhound View Post
The answer is to pull up your socks and build a new life for yourself elsewhere, and displaced persons have for generations. Refugees after WWII came to this country with little more than the clothing on their backs not even speaking the language, and most of them did pretty well for themselves here; and their children after them. NO refugees are at least (mostly) US citizens who speak the language; it should be a lot easier for them.
Maybe they should wander the streets until they find someone with a Mason's ring who would graciously help them.

No, wait, they're not dying. Oh well. Move along now. Nothing to see here.
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  #13  
Old 02 August 2007, 08:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elkhound View Post
The answer is to pull up your socks and build a new life for yourself elsewhere, and displaced persons have for generations. Refugees after WWII came to this country with little more than the clothing on their backs not even speaking the language, and most of them did pretty well for themselves here; and their children after them. NO refugees are at least (mostly) US citizens who speak the language; it should be a lot easier for them.
Right, we have such a massive poverty problem in general, and so many of the Katrina victims are still suffering, purely because they are too lazy to "pull their socks up" and get things handled.

I'm sure having no car, no mass transit, living away from majorly populated areas, being already poor (meaing no savings and such), and more then likely lacking education play no part in that, no, just lazyness..

Quote:
Originally Posted by Malruhn View Post
Poor JoAnn. She doesn't want a "job" - she wants a "job that meets all of her expectations and requirements." Okay, so housekeeping jobs are full - try applying to be a phreaking WAITRESS. I would bet that McDonalds is hiring as well. If she always does "her best" and wants to work, within a year she could be on her way to management.

That's something that has always bothered me. People claim they want jobs, but then set their standards so high - or put so many deliminators (or Eliminators) that they can't work. Kind of like my sister who bitches that she can't find a man... but there is only one Jude Law in existance, and he's taken... but she still bitches and won't change her standards.

If you NEED a job, there is work out there. It may not be pretty, and it may not be in what you WANT to do, but it is a job.
She looked for all sorts of jobs including fast food and found none, besides being a maid is hardly what I'd call respected work, its not like she's ruled out everything but being a manager at an electronics store..

Quote:
Originally Posted by Griffin2020 View Post
My point exactly, Malruhn. Wal-Mart is hiring...Wal-Mart is ALWAYS hiring. They may not have the highest pay or best benfits in the world, but they do pay, and they do offer insurance and other benefits.

I work in IT. When the Tech Sector crashed here, I could not find a job in IT. Did I say screw it, and sit around expecting the government to pay my way? Of course not. I went out and got a job waiting tables. A paycheck is a paycheck, and there is no job "below your dignity".
Odds are when the market crashed and you (presumably) lost your job or couldn't find one you had some savings, obviously had education (certainly a BS, maybe an MS) and probably a support network of friends and parents/family that could help you if push came to shove (maybe you ultimatly didn't need it, but itw as there), you also may not have been a single parent (I honestly don't know one way or the other) and probably had a car or some other reliable mode of transportation.

Thats pretty different, but hey correct me if I"m wrong.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hero_Mike View Post
Maybe they should wander the streets until they find someone with a Mason's ring who would graciously help them.

No, wait, they're not dying. Oh well. Move along now. Nothing to see here.
This still always cracks me up

-MB
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  #14  
Old 02 August 2007, 12:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Griffin2020 View Post
My point exactly, Malruhn. Wal-Mart is hiring...Wal-Mart is ALWAYS hiring. They may not have the highest pay or best benfits in the world, but they do pay, and they do offer insurance and other benefits.

I work in IT. When the Tech Sector crashed here, I could not find a job in IT. Did I say screw it, and sit around expecting the government to pay my way? Of course not. I went out and got a job waiting tables. A paycheck is a paycheck, and there is no job "below your dignity".
Around here at least, Walmart is not, in fact, always hiring.

People scramble for Walmart jobs, because it pays (slightly) over minimum wage.

And they don't offer insurance unless you are full time.

And full time mysteriously is never offered. The majority of the workers get just under enough hours to qualify for full time and benefits, for some strange and unknowable reason.

So the idea that anyone can get a job at Walmart just by showing up and saying, "oh okay, I'll work HERE already" is completly wrong in some communities at least. Such as mine.
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Old 02 August 2007, 12:56 PM
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Originally Posted by snapdragonfly View Post
Around here at least, Walmart is not, in fact, always hiring.
I was thinking about this some more and the idea that Walmart (or McDonalds or fill in soul sucking low paying job of choice) is always hiring is not only untrue it adds yet another layer of 'gee you really are a failure aren't you?" onto the backs of people already down on their luck.

I knew men who lost their jobs in the high tech crash who were turned down by retail employer after retail employer - obviously because they were over qualified and employers knew they'd leave as soon as something better was offered.

But these guys were all told by one person or another (usually very snottily) "Have you really tried everywhere? I wouldn't be too proud to work at McDonalds if the alternative was welfare".

Well neither were they! As you say just showing up and saying "I want a job" isn't going to get you one.
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Old 02 August 2007, 01:23 PM
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Unemployment rates in Memphis are pretty high if you're not a white male (4.2% for white non-Hispanic males vs. 12.9% for black non-Hispanic males). Black women have an 11% rate of unemployment.

If you are over 50 and trying to find unskilled, physical labor-intensive work, your chances only get worse.
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Old 02 August 2007, 01:27 PM
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It is possible that Katrina refugees are finding it harder than normal to get jobs precisely because they are Katrina refugees. Employers might see them as people who aren't going to stick around long, but will leave for home as soon as they can. If they don't have local roots (i.e., local job references, how long have you lived at this address, other questions typically found on a job application) it is much harder to convince an employer that you intend to stay at the job. If they know they might have to fill your position again in 6 months, they won't hire you - hiring and training new people is expensive.
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Old 02 August 2007, 07:00 PM
Magdalene Magdalene is offline
 
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Originally Posted by Christie View Post
I was thinking about this some more and the idea that Walmart (or McDonalds or fill in soul sucking low paying job of choice) is always hiring is not only untrue it adds yet another layer of 'gee you really are a failure aren't you?" onto the backs of people already down on their luck.

I knew men who lost their jobs in the high tech crash who were turned down by retail employer after retail employer - obviously because they were over qualified and employers knew they'd leave as soon as something better was offered.

But these guys were all told by one person or another (usually very snottily) "Have you really tried everywhere? I wouldn't be too proud to work at McDonalds if the alternative was welfare".

Well neither were they! As you say just showing up and saying "I want a job" isn't going to get you one.
::raises hand:: That was my story, off and on, from May 2003 to July 2005, as some here may remember. It wasn't that I was unwilling to work--I applied at places like Albertson's and Walgreens--but I did have it implied (and in one case, outright TOLD), "You're used to making $25 an hour, we can't match that/As soon as you get offered something in your field, you'll quit/As soon as you're offered more money somewhere else, you'll quit."

I can't blame them entirely for thinking that--it does seem unlikely that somebody who can analyze telephone usage patterns and recommend switch builds based off that is going to want to be a minimum wage cashier for long, if at all, but if somebody's applying for the job in the first place, you have to presume for whatever reason, at that moment, THEY WANT THE JOB.

Magdalene

ETA: Somewhat funny, but true anecdote from my life during this time period: June of 2005 I got a week-long temp job, for $10/hr, filing records for a mortgage company--and the day I started just happened to be the day that several temp agencies specializing in people for *telecom* jobs were calling me saying, "We've got a position for you, can you interview today?" And of course, most of the positions were on the other side of town, so I couldn't just go on my lunch break. Luckily, the woman at the mortgage company that I reported to was very understanding, she said, "You need a permanent job in your field, not a week-long assignment filing for us." We worked it out that I could leave in time for a four o'clock interview every day. I did get hired by one of those companies.

Last edited by Magdalene; 02 August 2007 at 07:06 PM.
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Old 02 August 2007, 07:39 PM
kismet kismet is offline
 
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Originally Posted by Buckleupp View Post
It is possible that Katrina refugees are finding it harder than normal to get jobs precisely because they are Katrina refugees. Employers might see them as people who aren't going to stick around long, but will leave for home as soon as they can. If they don't have local roots (i.e., local job references, how long have you lived at this address, other questions typically found on a job application) it is much harder to convince an employer that you intend to stay at the job. If they know they might have to fill your position again in 6 months, they won't hire you - hiring and training new people is expensive.
Yeah, one of the people in the article mentioned that her Louisiana driver's license gets in the way. Yes, there is the rootlessness aspect. There is also the fact that some pretty rough people from New Orleans migrated to the places where honest NO folks are looking for work and attached a pretty huge stigma to Katrina victims in general.

And no, Wal-Mart isn't hiring everywhere, nor is McDonalds. In some Gul-Coast areas, the stores that have re-opened cut back hours and therefore staff. And many places closed down. So you can't just walk into McDonalds and say "I'll start tomorrow."
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Old 02 August 2007, 07:48 PM
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Originally Posted by Christie View Post
If you have no car and do not have the means to buy one all the wonderful interstates in the world aren't going to be much help.
Or if you have a car but can't afford gas, at $2.50-$3.00/gallon, for a cross-country drive. Or if your car is old and unreliable and you can't afford to get stuck on the road.
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