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Old 18 October 2017, 11:16 PM
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Judge Judge orders Trump administration to allow abortion for undocumented teen

A federal judge on Wednesday ordered the U.S. government to allow an undocumented teenager in its custody to have an abortion, after saying she was “astounded” the Trump administration was trying to prevent the procedure.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/local...=.82f84b0fce7f
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  #2  
Old 18 October 2017, 11:20 PM
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Although the specific right here is important, it is also significant to note that the government attorneys centered their case on the arguments that undocumented immigrants have "minimal" constitutional protection, and not full constitutional rights -- an argument the judge rejected firmly. One could see how that could be broadened to affect any number of areas of concern.
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Old 19 October 2017, 06:57 PM
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Update to this case:
Appeals court temporarily blocks undocumented teen immigrant from getting abortion

https://thinkprogress.org/texas-teen...-78c09d147073/
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Old 19 October 2017, 08:07 PM
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Oh, the headline quote about overreach was from the ACLU. I thought it was from the appeals court, which would be painfully ironic.
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Old 19 October 2017, 09:04 PM
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A baby born to an undocumented immigrant is what Trump's type call an anchor baby. I thought they hated anchor babies.

Or is it like everything else about abortion, they only care while it is still inside the mother?

ETA: And yes, the idea that undocumented immigrants would have minimal constitutional protections is extremely frightening. And also unconstitutional since all of the rights are to persons, not citizens (except the right to vote). There are some cases where the rights of an undocumented immigrant would have to be limited, but such cases should require a very compelling reason. Not obtaining an abortion fails that test.

Last edited by GenYus234; 19 October 2017 at 09:12 PM.
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Old 19 October 2017, 09:44 PM
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What really gets me is that the young woman involved has jumped through all the hoops required by the state: since she's a minor, she had to get a court order; she's paying for it (or her guardian is), and has arranged transportation. So the Federal government is putting more obstacles in her way than the state of Texas.

That's just....argh. There are no words.
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Old 20 October 2017, 12:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GenYus234 View Post
A baby born to an undocumented immigrant is what Trump's type call an anchor baby. I thought they hated anchor babies.

Or is it like everything else about abortion, they only care while it is still inside the mother?
.
If they're thinking that far at all, they may be hoping to deport the pregnant teen before she gives birth, but late in the pregnancy: thereby probably making it next to impossible for her to abort, but landing the resulting unwanted child, once born, on whatever country they decide to deport her to.

Where I also think it unlikely that any of the people trying so hard to ensure such a person's existence will take any trouble about what becomes of them after they've been born. Or, of course, about what becomes of the already-existing teenager.
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Old 20 October 2017, 03:24 AM
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GenYus, I had similar thoughts, but in the fight between their hatred of women and their hatred of PoC, hatred of women won out. Though if pressed, I imagine most members of the GOP would do the same. Not sure why they hate women more than PoCs, given that the Southern Strategy is a defining part of their platform, but here we are.
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Old 20 October 2017, 04:48 AM
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I really don't think they put that much consideration into it. It was probably just "gotta punish the rhythms-with-mutt for having sex."
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Old 20 October 2017, 09:13 PM
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The hearing has been held; no ruling yet.

You can hear the audio of the arguments here:

https://www.cadc.uscourts.gov/recordings/recordings2018.nsf/EE442BCAB574219F852581BF0057B320/$file/17-5236.mp3

One revelation: the government attorney admitted for the first time that Jane Doe's home country does not permit abortions.
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Old 20 October 2017, 10:49 PM
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Default Appeals court blocks undocumented teen's access to abortion for now

A federal appeals court in Washington has blocked an immigrant teen held in Texas facility from obtaining an abortion for the time being.

The judges have given the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services until Tuesday, Oct. 31, to secure a temporary guardian for the teen. Once she has a temporary guardian, they can transport her to receive abortion services if she decides to go through with the procedure.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/appeals...s-to-abortion/
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Old 20 October 2017, 11:35 PM
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The headline puts a slightly negative slant on it, but I've been trying to avoid linking too many Washington Post articles (I subscribe now, but I know not everyone does, and you might hit a paywall). The court apparently said that the Federal government cannot block Jane Doe from having an abortion, but has given them ten days to find a temporary guardian so that they can avoid having to "facilitate" an abortion. ("Facilitating" in this case meaning just saying "OK.")

I listened to the arguments, and the court made it clear that it would prefer an alternative to making a ruling on the constitutional issues, since they touch on two highly sensitive issues (abortion and immigration). They did not buy the government's argument that they weren't actually denying the right to an abortion because the teen has the choice of leaving the country. One of the judges was pushing very hard on the idea of trying to find a sponsor for her -- effectively pushing the case out of the government's hands -- but they really seemed to trivialize the process, as though it would be simple to do within a few days, which I find highly improbable. (There has to be a background investigation and a home visit, among other things.)

I'm much more inclined to agree with the plaintiff's attorney, who stated it pretty bluntly: sure, we can talk about sponsors and other hypotheticals -- but Jane Doe's rights are being denied today, and harm is being done in the process. (She's already been delayed three weeks, pushing the abortion out of the first trimester.)

This to me seems like they're adding another delay, and much more complication, just so the government can pretend they're not involved -- although it was pointed out repeatedly that the government routinely goes further in "facilitating" abortions for adult detainees and women in federal prisons.

But it's better than a complete loss, I suppose.
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Old 23 October 2017, 05:39 PM
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As a further update: attorneys for Jane Doe is now asking the full appeals court to hear the case (all 10 judges, as opposed to the 3-judge panel that ruled on Friday). If this is denied, it seems likely they will attempt an appeal to the Supreme Court.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...=.893e5e12a656
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Old 23 October 2017, 07:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by E. Q. Taft View Post
She's already been delayed three weeks, pushing the abortion out of the first trimester.
Yeah, I've kind of wondered if the Trump administration's strategy is just to drag the case out until it becomes moot because she'll be so far along in her pregnancy it will be next to impossible for her to get an abortion anyway.
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Old 23 October 2017, 08:16 PM
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Seems likely.
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Old 23 October 2017, 09:12 PM
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Texas won't allow it after 20 weeks, so that's the clock they're theoretically working against -- but, it was made clear in the hearing, it's more complicated than that; some of the individual doctors or clinics have earlier deadlines. Also complicating matters is the Texas counseling law, which says the patient must have a counseling session at least 24 hours prior to the operation with the surgeon who will perform it. Jane Doe had her counseling session last Thursday, with the plan to have the operation Friday -- but that was halted. Now that surgeon is not available, so if she gets clearance to go forward, she will have to have a new session with the new doctor. If the delay stretches on much more, there won't be any local doctors who can/will perform the operation, and she would need to travel hundreds of miles to the northern part of the state for access.

I don't know how much of this is actually coming from Trump's gut, how much of it is just calculated to appeal to a particular segment of voters, and how much of it may be being pushed by Pence. In any case, it's infuriating on so many levels -- like just about everything else he does.
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Old 25 October 2017, 04:48 AM
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Default U.S. Must Let Undocumented Teenager Get an Abortion, Appeals Court Says

On Tuesday, a federal appeals court in Washington sided with the girl, sending the case back to a lower court, which immediately ordered the Trump administration to allow the girl to obtain an abortion “promptly and without delay.” The ruling may be only one of many legal chapters to come if the Justice Department decides to appeal to the Supreme Court.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/10/24/u...-abortion.html
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Old 25 October 2017, 03:50 PM
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Anyone who hasn't read that NY Times article should. I SOL'd (swore out loud) multiple times. This is why, even if you hated Hilary for whatever reason, it doesn't work to say you won't vote for the lesser of two evils. Because it does matter when the greater one is so much worse. They are systematically, with great foresight and deliberation, forcing girls and women in their custody to bear children, and subjecting them to religious coercion and indoctrination.

They placed decision-making authority in one single, anti-choice person for approval of abortions for detainees--which is, of course, the detainee's right, and not really subject to the approval of a federal official. There is no decision to be made. The process, at a pretty local level, should be, does she want an abortion? Yes? Then make the arrangements she needs for that.

The government lawyers have argued, among other things, that the government had an interest in "promoting childbirth." I can't express how angry this makes me, and in how many ways. I literally can't. I will say that a part of my anger comes from being the partner of a woman who almost died from being pregnant, and a big part of why she is still alive is that she was privileged to be receiving incredibly good and vigilant care at the time.
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Old 25 October 2017, 04:47 PM
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From the NYT article:

Quote:
“Under today’s decision, pregnant alien minors the world around seeking elective abortions will be on notice that they should make the trip” to the United States, [Judge Karen LeCraft Henderson] wrote.
[head-desk]

What world does she live in that she considers that a realistic things to be concerned about?
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Old 25 October 2017, 04:53 PM
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Default Undocumented teen has abortion amid legal battle

The undocumented teen who sought an abortion in the U.S. had her abortion this morning -- CBS News' Paula Reid reports -- before the Justice Department could appeal Tuesday's decision clearing the way for the teen to have the abortion.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/undocum...-legal-battle/
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