Verizon check

[snopes]

Comment: There was no text with this forwarded picture of a check payable to Verizon using a mathematical equation for the amount. Any idea if it is real or the story behind it?

[lynnejanet]

How come the black handwriting is so much clearer than the red and black type?

Any math whizzes among the snopesters?

ETA: posters on other websites calculate the result as 0.02 of a cent (or $0.0002, I guess), and therefore worth nothing. There doesn't seem to be anything to back up its veracity, though.

[Squishy0405]

I am SO fowarding this to the only math whiz I know. He's a college math professor so this should be easy but I will endure the lengthy & tiring explanation for you all. I'll take a hit for the team!

[Chance]

The cheque was made by Randall Munroe, who does the very funny (and geeky) webcomic xkcd, in response to this conflict with Verizon.

Geekiness to the rescue!

[ToadMagnet]

This image usually goes with the story (and recording) about the engineer who could not get across to the Verizon employees that $.002 is not the same as $.02

http://youtube.com/watch?v=Gp0HyxQv97Q

(I think that's the right link.) There was a thread about this last month.

Toad"Clowns to the left of me, jokers to the right"Magnet

ETA: Gah! Spanked whilst looking for the link!

[lynnejanet]

Originally Posted by Chance

The cheque was made by Randall Munroe, who does the very funny (and geeky) webcomic xkcd, in response to this conflict with Verizon.

Geekiness to the rescue!

That call is hilarious! The pauses between responses by the Verizon staff are priceless.

[Chance]

Originally Posted by ToadMagnet

This image usually goes with the story (and recording) about the engineer who could not get across to the Verizon employees that $.002 is not the same as $.02

http://youtube.com/watch?v=Gp0HyxQv97Q

(I think that's the right link.) There was a thread about this last month.

Toad"Clowns to the left of me, jokers to the right"Magnet

ETA: Gah! Spanked whilst looking for the link!

Wow! I've never spanked anyone before! (Well, not on the Internet, anyway). It was interesting to read the Youtube comments on that.

[CSGirl]

Originally Posted by lynnejanet

That call is hilarious! The pauses between responses by the Verizon staff are priceless.

Wow. I'm listening to it now- there is no way I would have as much patience as he did. Wow. It reminds me of recent conversations with my loan company, and I could not have kept my cool for as long as he did, and with so many different people, repeating the same thing.

[lynnejanet]

Originally Posted by CSGirl

Wow. I'm listening to it now- there is no way I would have as much patience as he did. Wow. It reminds me of recent conversations with my loan company, and I could not have kept my cool for as long as he did, and with so many different people, repeating the same thing.

Go to the link on YouTube of the really bad math teacher, presenting the same problem, and read the comments. There are about 3 people who argue over and over that Verizon is right and the caller is wrong. Hilarious, I tells ya!

[CSGirl]

Originally Posted by lynnejanet

Go to the link on YouTube of the really bad math teacher, presenting the same problem, and read the comments. There are about 3 people who argue over and over that Verizon is right and the caller is wrong. Hilarious, I tells ya!

Which link is it? I don't see it.

[lynnejanet]

Originally Posted by CSGirl

Which link is it? I don't see it.

Sorry. It's http://youtube.com/watch?v=61J85cHww...elated&search=

I apologize - I still haven't figured out links and embedded quotes.:o

[CSGirl]

Originally Posted by lynnejanet

Sorry. It's http://youtube.com/watch?v=61J85cHww...elated&search=

I apologize - I still haven't figured out links and embedded quotes.:o

Thanks. For links, (in advanced), you can type the word you want to mask it with, highlight it, and click the link button to insert the link. Or, put the link in like you have it, then replace the text between the ] and [ with the text you want.

[Chance]

This seems like as good a time as any good time to link to the Randall Munroe's opinion of youtube commenters. Evidence seems to bear him out.

I had this forwarded to me recently as "Never piss off an engineer." Given the use of Euler's Formula and a geometric series, I'd say it was most likely cooked up by an electrical engineer. A mathematician could probably come up with some harder formulas.

[Jay Temple]

Indeed, I would have worked a trig function in there somewhere.

Jay "We're number tan π/4" Temple

[Hero_Mike]

Originally Posted by HerrLip

I had this forwarded to me recently as "Never piss off an engineer." Given the use of Euler's Formula and a geometric series, I'd say it was most likely cooked up by an electrical engineer. A mathematician could probably come up with some harder formulas.

As an electrical engineer, I find that comment moderately offensive.

I could probably come up with some harder formulas just from one specific field (antennas), never mind some of the other stuff that I work with more regularly.

I also wonder why you chose to disparage only *electrical* engineers?

By the way, the infinite sum is indeed a geometric series of the form E a* r^k, with a=1, r= 1/2, and with k starting at 1 and not 0. Since 1/(2^0) = 1/1, we can just do the sum via the formula and subtract one.

To wit : (k=0 to inf) E a*r^k = a / (1-r)

For a=1, r=1/2, the sum is 2.

So, (k=1 to inf) E 1/(2^k) = 1, as explained above.

Euler's identity is e^(i*pi) + 1 =0, so e^(i*pi) = -1.

So the check is for $0.002.

Next time solve the problem, and don't insult people.

Originally Posted by Hero_Mike

As an electrical engineer, I find that comment moderately offensive.

I could probably come up with some harder formulas just from one specific field (antennas), never mind some of the other stuff that I work with more regularly.

I also wonder why you chose to disparage only *electrical* engineers?

...

Next time solve the problem, and don't insult people.

No insult intended. I'm an EE. I singled out EEs because Euler's formula is one of the most fundamental concepts in the entire field, and geometric series are about the equivalent in DSP. I'm not aware of any other engineering fields that use these two formulas as extensively, although I admittedly don't know too much about other engineering fields. I'm simply saying that based on what I know of engineering, science, and mathematics, it seems most likely to me that the check was composed by an EE. I think a pure mathematician would come up with something more graceful.

[Hero_Mike]

Originally Posted by HerrLip

I think a pure mathematician would come up with something more graceful.

Graceful? Euler's identity is known as the "greatest equation ever", not to mention that it is also touted for its simplicity and "mathematical beauty".

If an electrical engineer wanted to *crudely* express the value of "-1", he would say j^2, because any good electrical engineer doesn't use "i" for the square root of -1. "i", of course, is reserved as an abbreviation for current, in both upper and lower case.

Euler's identity is not for the faint of heart. Amateurs should not be playing with imaginary numbers.

[PallasAthena]

Very amusing. I was also amused by the comments posted to youtube. Just... wow.

Even if other snopesters think he won't be winning any prizes for his choice of equation (not something I'm qualified to comment on), but he DOES deserve a prize for patience on the strength of that linked phone call.