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-   -   Duchess Anne's Heart stolen (http://message.snopes.com/showthread.php?t=96596)

Kermor 15 April 2018 02:16 PM

Duchess Anne's Heart stolen
 
Quote:

The 16th century engraved golden case that once held the relic heart of Anne de Bretagne has been stolen from the Dobrée museum in Nantes (Loire-Atlantique, Pays-de-la-Loire).
https://www.connexionfrance.com/Fren...retagne-stolen

https://www.connexionfrance.com/var/...ticleimage.jpg

As a Breton, that makes my blood boil. Let's hope it will be found rapidly, and in good state. If not, we might have lost one of the most, if not the most valuable piece of our history. :mad:

DawnStorm 16 April 2018 02:08 PM

Any clues yet? I imagine it's in someone's private collection; good luck fencing such a well known item.

ETA: I liken it to someone breaking in to the National Archives and making off with the Constitution.

Seaboe Muffinchucker 16 April 2018 03:32 PM

Let's just pray that the thieves don't melt it down.

Seaboe

crocoduck_hunter 16 April 2018 05:49 PM

I can't imagine anyone who'd bother stealing such a famous item just to melt it down. If that's all you wanted to do, there are plenty of much less famous and easier to steal items to choose from. I'm also guessing that it's bound for the private villa of some rich person.

GenYus234 16 April 2018 06:15 PM

Possibly more than one.

jimmy101_again 17 April 2018 02:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crocoduck_hunter (Post 1976659)
I can't imagine anyone who'd bother stealing such a famous item just to melt it down. If that's all you wanted to do, there are plenty of much less famous and easier to steal items to choose from. I'm also guessing that it's bound for the private villa of some rich person.

It may have been that the security for that particular piece wasn't very good. If it is easy to steal someone may well have been after just the value of the gold.

ganzfeld 17 April 2018 02:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GenYus234 (Post 1976663)

I'm sure you realize this but just to be clear: The story of the forgeries is, as that article says, "garbage".

musicgeek 17 April 2018 03:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jimmy101_again (Post 1976694)
It may have been that the security for that particular piece wasn't very good. If it is easy to steal someone may well have been after just the value of the gold.

Especially given that the other items stolen (according to the article) were a golden Hindu statue and some gold coins.

ChasFink 17 April 2018 02:17 PM

This means the stolen goods are likely headed for the crucible and not a collector's shelf. A pity. But I wonder: is there not less conspicuous gold out there to be stolen?

GenYus234 17 April 2018 03:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ganzfeld (Post 1976695)
I'm sure you realize this but just to be clear: The story of the forgeries is, as that article says, "garbage".

Yes, but the idea still has merit. A decent forger could sell multiple copies of the same item because the buyer likely can't have it appraised by an expert.

Dasla 18 April 2018 08:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GenYus234 (Post 1976721)
Yes, but the idea still has merit. A decent forger could sell multiple copies of the same item because the buyer likely can't have it appraised by an expert.

And they can't really tell many people they have it. So no one can say "Hey Joe Blogs in Whoville says they have that."

ganzfeld 18 April 2018 08:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GenYus234 (Post 1976721)
Yes, but the idea still has merit. A decent forger could sell multiple copies of the same item because the buyer likely can't have it appraised by an expert.

Well, I'm going to have to disagree about the "has merit" part. I don't think such a (needlessly?) elaborate ruse has ever happened in the history of forgeries. It's just a trope of fiction. (And I'm pretty sure that trope was invented or at the very least almost entirely popularised by the fictional Mona Lisa theft-forgery caper.)

GenYus234 18 April 2018 03:55 PM

I'm afraid you've been duped by Big Museum if you think it has never happened.

ChasFink 18 April 2018 05:46 PM

Even WITH appraisal, forgeries are sometimes accepted as real. A documentary I saw on PBS followed a man who forged art in many styles, often using crude techniques, and would use false identities to sell the works to galleries and museums. He was seldom spotted, and not immediately.

If a theft opportunity presents itself to a motivated individual, the plan has merit. It may be more difficult with a copy of a known work, but I do not doubt it's possible.

dfresh 18 April 2018 06:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GenYus234 (Post 1976821)
I'm afraid you've been duped by Big Museum if you think it has never happened.

GenYus, let it go, or some goons will show up to "curate you" until you keep quiet about this.

ganzfeld 19 April 2018 02:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GenYus234 (Post 1976821)
I'm afraid you've been duped by Big Museum if you think it has never happened.

You got me there! :) Five things They don't want you to know about Impression Sunrise!

I'm of the (minority?) opinion that if there were a perfect copy down to the molecular level then it wouldn't matter whether it was a forgery or not. But that thought experiment is little comfort with something as irreplaceable as what was lost in the OP. I just hope it's found or returned before anything bad happens.

ChasFink 19 April 2018 03:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ganzfeld (Post 1976887)
I'm of the (minority?) opinion that if there were a perfect copy down to the molecular level then it wouldn't matter whether it was a forgery or not.

I would agree with you there - even on a much more macroscopic level - as far as the appreciation of the work is concerned. But to me the point of originality in these cases is more the commercial or collector's value. A Picasso is worth something because Picasso put the paint on the canvas, the same way a set of Spock ear tips are worth something because they touched Leonard Nimoy's (or Zachary Quinto's?) ears.

If we were literally talking about a molecular-level copy we might get into a whole other philosophical argument about identity, but let's leave that for another day.

GenYus234 19 April 2018 03:28 PM

So it is still your grandfather's axe?

ChasFink 19 April 2018 05:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GenYus234 (Post 1976914)
So it is still your grandfather's axe?

Is what my grandfather's axe?

When a friend in college found out I was studying Philosophy, she asked what that entailed. I said something like "the basic questions in life, morals, and things like whether it's the same boat if you replace a board each day until no part of the original boat remains" She presented her boyfriend with the problem, and - despite centuries of debate on the question - he definitively declared it was not the same boat. When asked when it stopped being the same boat, he said "exactly halfway."

GenYus234 19 April 2018 05:25 PM

That was in response to ganzfeld's post.


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